Episode 14

John Wick (2014) - WICK UNFORGIVEN - Part Two

Breaking Down John Wick with Blake Snyder's Beat Sheet

Jerome and Chris dig into the action-packed world of 'John Wick.' Using Blake Snyder's beat sheet as a framework, Jerome meticulously dissects the movie's plot, pacing, and character development, and along the way, points out several intriguing plot issues, provides insights on 'praise of the killer,' and shares entertaining trivia. The brothers also touch on their favorite lines of dialogue and the film’s standout moments. Tune in for an engaging analysis that blends professional breakdowns with laid-back banter, all while enjoying some fine whiskey!

00:00 Introduction to John Wick

00:29 Hosts and Drinks

00:47 Episode Theme and Movie Discussion

03:30 John Wick Movie Specs

06:10 John Wick's Popularity and Trivia

10:52 John Wick's Plot and Character Analysis

16:29 Script Issues and Key Scenes

35:53 The Spiritual Significance of John Wick's Dog

36:55 The Worst Line in the Movie

37:55 John Wick's Iconic Comeback Line

38:49 Break into Three: The Turning Point

39:12 The Anti-Hero Father: Viggo's Betrayal

39:42 The Five-Point Finale

40:02 The Humane Execution of Iosef

41:04 Hightower Surprise: Marcus's Fate

41:22 Debate Begins Again: Seeking Revenge

41:53 Execution of the New Plan

42:22 Closing Image: A New Hope

44:35 Plot Issues in John Wick

52:33 Praise of the Killer: Building the Myth

57:34 Trivia and Final Thoughts

01:03:01 Six Degrees of Separation Game

01:08:51 Upcoming Movies and Final Wrap-Up

Buy or Rent John Wick

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Transcript
Jerome:

While John wasn't exactly the boogeyman, he was the one you

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sent to kill the fucking boogeyman.

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John is a man of focus,

commitment, sheer will.

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I once saw him kill three

men in a bar with a pencil.

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A fucking pencil.

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End quote.

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Like, so, you know, if these

two are not praise of the killer

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speeches, I don't know what is.

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Right.

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Right?

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Chris: You're listening to

the Silver Screen Happy Hour.

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I'm Chris Wiegand along

with my brother Jerome.

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Jerome: Still here.

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Chris: He's a couple of

shots and a beer in now.

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So uh, what movies are we talking about?

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Jerome: Really good whiskey.

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Let me tell you, really good whiskey.

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So this is the second episode.

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This is the part two of our Wick

Unforgiven episode, where we we

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did Unforgiven in the first episode

and we're doing John Wick now.

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The theme of these two episodes is Are the

uh, I was once a killer sort of mentality.

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So again, if you have not listened to the

unforgiven episode, it sets up this one.

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So you should go back and

listen to that one first.

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Chris: So uh, really quick,

what are we drinking?

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What movies are we doing?

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What are we doing here?

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Jerome: So, so we're doing

Unforgiven and John Wick.

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Now, in the previous episode, I

talked about, well, you go first.

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Go ahead.

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Chris: Just drinking some whiskey.

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Don't mind me.

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Jerome: Alright, so,

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So, you, but you didn't say

what you were drinking there.

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Chris: I just went for some Jameson.

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Just what I had in the house.

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Yeah, it's a very nice whiskey.

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Very nice.

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Um, Probably should have went with

old American whiskey or like you.

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Okay, you actually,

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Jerome: thank you for the lead in.

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So as mentioned in the previous

episode, my neighbor, Eric, for my

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49th birthday, which was just last

week, got me this bottle of Blanton's.

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Original single barrel bourbon whiskey,

and it's in a little round bottle, and

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it is literally the same bottle that's

in the movie John wick when he's got

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the doctor in his room and stitching

him up and he's drinking the whiskey.

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So thank you to Eric again.

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I gave him a shout out

in the previous episode.

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I already had this couple of

these and my ice is melted now.

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But that's fine.

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I have my lightsabers here, my Mic

ultra talls, but you know what?

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Just because I'm that kind of guy.

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We're going to do another small one here.

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Chris: Do a small one.

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We got, we got to get

through this second podcast.

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Jerome: Neat.

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No ice.

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And yeah, see this is, it's not much,

it's, it's just a little bit there.

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And again, we're going to get fucked up.

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We're going to get fucked up.

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Hey man, as I said, the previous episode,

these are two really fun movies to watch.

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All right.

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Now I say fun for a reason and not,

these are both really great movies.

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You're going to find I have way

more problems with John Wick

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than I had with Unforgiven.

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Chris: With the script or what?

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With the script.

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Jerome: Now the structure is fine.

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But I just find and again

I've forgiven these.

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plot holes with stuff like Star Wars.

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If I like a movie, I'll forgive the

plot holes, but there is a shitload

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of problems I have with this movie,

but we'll get to it when it comes.

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For all you John Wick

super fans, don't get mad.

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It's just a movie.

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Uh, We all love Keanu.

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I love him too.

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Let's move on.

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All right.

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Specs.

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John Wick 2014 directed by Chad Stahelski.

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Stahelski, written by Derek Kolstad.

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Both have made their careers, by the

way, on the fuckin John Wick franchise.

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Stahelski's only directing credits

are the four John Wick films.

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Wow.

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And Kolstad also wrote all four films,

as well as TV spinoffs and video games

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that are all related to John Wick.

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Wow.

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He has other writing credits, but it,

I mean, it's, I think it's safe to

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say that there's a special place in

these guys' hearts for this franchise.

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Running time is one hour, 41 minutes

with a budget of $20 million.

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It was released on October 24th,

:

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I'm sorry.

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Yeah, $43 million domestic, which.

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Disappointing 79th place well behind

movies like Muppets most wanted and

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horrible bosses, too However, it did beat

out The Expendables 3 and Anchorman 2

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So if you haven't caught on yet to how

what kind of a year:

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the year of the franchises and sequels.

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The top, here's the top

five movies of the year.

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I'm going to, I'm going to do

them in reverse order and you'll

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see it's loaded with franchises.

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Five.

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Transformers Age of Extinction.

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That's actually the fourth

movie in that franchise.

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It was the fifth grossing

movie of the year.

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Number four, The Lego Movie, which was the

first, but it's the Lego brand, you know.

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We already knew the Lego brand.

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Three, Captain America The Winter Soldier.

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It's a Marvel movie.

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We all know that.

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It might have been the tenth

Marvel movie made by that point.

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2, the number 2 movie of the year,

Hunger Games Mockingjay Part 1, which is

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actually the third film in that series.

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And the number 1 movie of

the year:

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Chris: I don't know, what?

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Jerome: Guardians of the Galaxy.

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Oh, So now in all fairness, the guardians

of the galaxy was the first movie.

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It's volume one.

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But it's still under the Marvel

tag, you know what I mean?

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So it's still part of the Marvel list

of 20 some movies that led to end game.

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Those were the five top

grossing movies of the year.

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So John wick wasn't a franchise yet.

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It was the first movie.

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People probably looked at it as,

Oh, it's another taken or it's

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another born identity or whatever.

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I mean, here we are four movies later,

you know, and you could, you could call

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John wick a pretty successful franchise.

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Chris: I have some trivia,

I have some trivia.

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It's not scientific trivia or anything.

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It's just something I

know from my son actually.

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So like, I know like John wick gained

in popularity after it came out.

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In part a lot of the videos

of Keanu Reeves training.

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That came out on YouTube for the movie.

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My son, he kept showing

me all these videos.

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And then finally he just said, all

right, we're going to watch the movie.

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So he, I, he came over, I bought

the movie and that was, so that was

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my first experience with the movie.

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I know you're going to ask me that.

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Jerome: Wait, yeah, we're not there

yet, but, but I was, but a lot of, a lot

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Chris: of, a lot of people got turned on

to the movie because they realized like

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from these videos that went viral of.

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Training for the movie.

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The shooting ranges and stuff

and how he handles a gun.

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He's like one of the most well

trained, you know, actors of,

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you know, with firearms in

Hollywood because of this film.

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And that, and the Matrix, I should

say, because he, that's where that,

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I think that really kicked off his

training in this type of stuff.

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But he, he went over, he did

some overtime training for this.

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Jerome: Absolutely.

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In fact, one of the other trivia points,

I don't think I even wrote this down.

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Absolutely.

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He did 90 percent of his

own stunts in this movie.

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And and like you said, I was going to

say this film got dwarfed by the giants.

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That year as far as the franchise

films, but this did become it like you

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said a cult following There was a cult

following to this film much like how

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Terminator didn't do that huge at the

box office But once it hit video, right

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all of a sudden it blew up right and

then t2 was the most anticipated sequel

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Maybe in history at that time, right?

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Except for maybe Empire Strikes Back.

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Maybe t2 is huge.

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But anyway,

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Chris: yeah

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Jerome: So so yeah, a lot of love for

Keanu and again, Keanu had a time where

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after he got out of the 80s and he was

in the 90s, he had films that were action

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films, but I want to say, I'm going to say

this as delicately as possible uh, they

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were mocked more than they were loved, you

know, like movies like Johnny Mnemonic,

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Speed, Speed, You know, whatever.

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Chris: Like there's enough C4

to put a hole in the world,

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Jerome: put a hole in the world.

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Take my hand.

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The elevator is going to fall.

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Come on.

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You know, like, like

just nobody was buying.

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Keanu then, but then a

weird thing happened.

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He got older and he's hair

grew out and he has a beard.

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And he went on talk shows where he said.

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mystical things and people were

like, is this like Joaquin Phoenix

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described, you know, like this

dressed up as Keanu Reeves.

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Like he started saying like things,

people just started to love him.

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You know what I mean?

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And he started to get this following

where people loved Keanu Reeves again.

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And then John wick comes out.

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And his fucking dog gets killed!

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And it's like, I have to

love Keanu Reeves now!

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And, and, and that, I, I have,

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say

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that the strength of these four

movies all started with this dog.

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Yeah.

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Like, I mean, You Harm a Dog, Fuck you.

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Chris: What do they

call that in filmmaking?

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Where you do something

to give sympathy to the

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Jerome: Well, you mean

the save the cat moment?

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Save the cat!

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Yeah, it's basically a

save the cat thing, right?

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So again, our podcasts are laced after

Blake Snyder and his trilogy of books.

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About the Blake Snedder Beat

Sheet and the Save the Cat books.

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Yeah.

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Chris: How do you get

sympathy for an assassin?

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Kill his dog.

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Kill his dog?

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That his dead wife gave him.

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Jerome: Oh my god.

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Fuck.

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Now, we're going to get to that.

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Now, I was going to say, okay, it

garnered zero Academy Award nominations.

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But, it did win the biggest

surprise of the year award

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at the Golden Schmoes Award.

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Golden Schmoes?

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I'd learned about it today

when I looked up the trivia.

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Okay this movie stars Keanu Reeves as John

Wick, Michael Nyquist as Viggo Tarasov,

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Elfie Allen as Iosef Tarasov, his son

Game of Thrones fans would know him.

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He has a long running in

that series as Theon Greyjoy.

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Willem Dafoe as Marcus, John Leguizamo

as Aurelio, and Ian McShane as Winston.

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Also, Dean Winters, known as

Mayhem in the long running

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Allstate insurance commercials.

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Plays Vigo's number two.

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His name's Avi, and Adrian Pilecki

as Perkins, another assassin.

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All right, so when did

you first see this movie?

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Now you can tell your story.

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Chris: Yeah, I don't remember the year.

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What year did this come out?

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14?

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This was 2014.

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So it came, I mean, I saw it, Several

years after it came out, cause I

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didn't see it at the theater, and I, I

bought the, I bought it on Amazon and

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watched it with my son at our house.

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So, and we, I remember, gosh,

it was probably, I want to say

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2018, maybe, something like that.

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2018.

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Jerome: About four years after?

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Yeah,

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Chris: four years.

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So I didn't watch any of them until, And

you know, I just, just wasn't on my radar.

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and my son joined the army in 2018.

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So it was right around that time.

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I think maybe right before he

went in maybe that's when he had

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me watch it, something like that.

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But he's always been into

firearms and, you know, we used

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to do boy scouts and stuff.

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So he was always really good at that.

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You know, doing the shooting

competitions and stuff.

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And of course, when he got into

the army he just continued that

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passion, with firearms and, and

he actually paints his own guns.

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Some pretty custom paint jobs

on some of these guns now.

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Really, really gets into it.

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Anyways, that was my experience with this.

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I'm guessing it was around

:

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Jerome: So, guess when I

first watched John Wick?

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Chris: When?

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Jerome: About three weeks ago.

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Seriously?

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First time ever.

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It was one of those, we

talked about this with Hugo.

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Chris: It's unusual, usually it's

me that hasn't seen the movie.

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Jerome: Yeah, this one just

slipped through the cracks.

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Now, I had heard of it, obviously.

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I'm very much aware of John Wick.

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And I know it's not but I think with

the saturation I felt of the Bourne

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movies and the Taken movies I just felt

it was just the same of all those and

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if I've seen one I've seen them all and

I just never I just didn't go to the

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theater I didn't see any I haven't seen

any of the other sequels by the way,

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Chris: right?

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Jerome: And then three weeks ago.

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I was like I saw it on streaming

and I was like, ah, fuck it.

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So I watched it and after I watched

it, that's when I text you and said we

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should do John wick versus Unforgiven.

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So then I watched it two more

times to prepare for the podcast.

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So in all I've seen it three times

and three times in three weeks.

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And that's my experience with the movie.

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That's it.

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All right, log me.

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Chris: All right.

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This is a long one.

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An ex hit man comes out of retirement

to track down the gangsters who

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killed his dog and stole his car.

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Jerome: Okay.

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So I don't know if you remember, I text

you that we're going to do an exercise.

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Do you have your piece of paper and pen?

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Okay.

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I want you to write this.

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Did you already write it down?

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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You wrote down the log line, right?

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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Now grab your pen.

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Chris: Yeah.

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Jerome: Okay.

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I want you to cross

out the word gangsters.

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And right above it, write, Cowboys.

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Now, I want you to scratch out,

Killed his dog and stole his car.

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And above it, write, Cut up a prostitute.

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And now read me the logline.

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Chris: Okay.

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An ex hitman comes out of

retirement to track down the

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cowboys who cut up a prostitute.

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Same movie.

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Jerome: Sound familiar?

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Sound familiar?

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Chris: I know, right?

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Yeah.

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I kind of knew you were going to do that.

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I had a feeling.

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I mean, you know.

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Jerome: So, but again, but there's a

reason why there's a million of these.

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The Bourne movies, the Taken

movies, the Wick movies, Unforgiven.

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You There's a reason why we love

this shit and they still make money.

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And all you got to do is say

you could write the same fucking

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movie, just change it a little bit.

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And there's a reason why

audiences will flock to it.

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We love this shit.

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Chris: Yeah.

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Right.

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They did something really cool and

you're probably going to get into it

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as you as you start breaking down the

script But in this movie, they did

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something really cool with dialogue

Like they they tell you so much without

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saying anything or saying very little

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Jerome: My god, I love the dialogue.

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Chris: Yeah, they just say there's

a little line and you're like, oh

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Jerome: Now do you remember

when we did Oppenheimer?

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And I was like, Jesus Christ,

like every line of dialogue is

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like a legendary line of dialogue.

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Like there's so many

great lines in that movie.

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I might have problems with some

plot holes in this movie, but God

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damn, I love the lines of dialogue.

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They are really spot on.

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Chris: Well, it informs the viewer

so much about this character, John

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Wick, without really saying much.

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Just the reaction of people.

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Jerome: Don't, don't, don't spill it.

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I got a whole segment on that.

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All right, let's go.

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All right.

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All right.

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Side note on this former killer thing

that we talked about with Unforgiven.

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So with that similar of a log line

that we just did the exercise on right?

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We can transition to what we talked

about earlier as the similarities

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and differences done forgiven.

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There's a lot less spiritual

regret of the past from John wick.

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That William Money had he doesn't have

these hauntings of his sins gone by thing

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and, you know, for John Wick, it's almost

like he's finally tasting water after

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crawling through a desert for years.

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You know what I mean?

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Like, he's welcoming this return.

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William Money.

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Yeah.

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You know what I mean?

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Those are the, that's the biggest

difference between these two.

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So, okay, issues with the script.

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I, I'm saving most of these for later.

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I, I just have to say that

I did enjoy this movie.

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I enjoyed it very much.

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I love the dialogue.

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Some of the sins of this

movie are glaringly obvious.

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And, and probably could have made the

film a bigger hit if they were addressed.

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But, I'm not, I'm we'll

get to it when it comes.

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Okay, we have.

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The beats.

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Opening image.

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Slow driving, beat up car

slowly crashes into building.

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John Wick exits the vehicle bloodied

and seemingly close to death.

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In media res, right?

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We talked about that in the Fargo episode.

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The story has already started and

we're coming in halfway through.

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Actually, this is a fake in media

res because they just took something

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that happens later and they edited

it to show it at the beginning just

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to give the the crowd a little a

little morsel of what might come.

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So I guess it's technically

not in Meteor ez.

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But it immediately goes into the setup.

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An alarm goes off, John wakes up

on the day of his wife's funeral.

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We see this brief relationship, highs and

lows through flashback montage, right?

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Um, Mm hmm.

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Who is it?

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Bridget Monaghan, I think plays

his, his wife in flashback.

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A fairly big name actress.

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And she does the, this, I

wouldn't say a courtesy bit.

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Yeah.

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I'll be in your movie for two minutes

where you just show me in flashback and

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I have to do very literally zero acting.

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But anyway, it's, it's

nice to see her again.

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She's been in a lot of movies.

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It was fun that she played the wife.

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The image of the daisy

starts making its appearance.

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It was a favorite of the wife's.

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It's on her coffee mug.

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It's on her bracelet.

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It's everywhere and it's a

constant reminder of her.

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Uh, We get to the funeral

and we meet Marcus.

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And it's established that John has known

Marcus for a long time and he's a friend.

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While not necessarily Played by

389

:

Chris: Willem Dafoe.

390

:

Jerome: Willem Dafoe, yeah.

391

:

Now, not Did I miss that?

392

:

Oh, no, I said that part.

393

:

I meant that.

394

:

And by the way, for anyone that's

listening, the reason why I go through

395

:

the cast and the characters that

they play is because when we do these

396

:

breakdowns, I only name them by character.

397

:

Yeah.

398

:

So if you don't know who I'm talking

about, that's why at the beginning I

399

:

mentioned Willem Dafoe plays Marcus.

400

:

So when I say Marcus, you

know, it's Willem Dafoe.

401

:

Yeah.

402

:

Just to give a little visual to it.

403

:

But anyway.

404

:

So, well, not necessarily the theme.

405

:

Marcus does drop a great line

for anyone dealing with grief.

406

:

He says, quote, there's no

rhyme or reason to this life.

407

:

Days like this scattered among the rest.

408

:

And John replies, are you sure?

409

:

So again, it's just, it's not the theme.

410

:

But it's teasing sort of

the theme a little bit.

411

:

All right, here's where

we get to the theme.

412

:

John is home cleaning up after

the funerals get together

413

:

and someone is at the door.

414

:

They are delivering a

package to John, a puppy.

415

:

It's from his wife.

416

:

We know this when he opens the card and

sees the Daisy picture on the envelope.

417

:

As he reads it, we hear her voiceover

telling him, That she got him the dog

418

:

when she knew she was dying so that

he would have someone to love again.

419

:

At the seven minute mark, she drops

the theme stated for John Wick and

420

:

for the entire rest of the film.

421

:

Quote, now that I've found

my peace, find yours.

422

:

There will be a lot of push and pull for

John trying to decide what is his piece.

423

:

What is the part of him that he needs

back in his life now that she's gone?

424

:

Again, it has three sequels.

425

:

There's four John Wick movies.

426

:

Chris: You can

427

:

Jerome: figure out what his piece was that

he needed to get back to, but it takes the

428

:

whole movie for him to get there, right?

429

:

And we're going to get to that

point at the end, the part that

430

:

you were talking about earlier.

431

:

All right, so he opens the

cage and pulls out a dog.

432

:

Her name tag states that her

name is, unsurprisingly, Daisy.

433

:

Cute little doggie, too.

434

:

Little puppy.

435

:

Uh, Oddly enough uh, The, the first thing

uh, I want to say is the next day he's

436

:

wearing a white shirt with a brown leather

jacket and it matches the dog's fur.

437

:

Chris: Coloring.

438

:

Yeah.

439

:

Jerome: Right.

440

:

White and brown.

441

:

Right.

442

:

It's a mistake.

443

:

That's all done on purpose.

444

:

And he's got black hair, right?

445

:

So, he's got black hair.

446

:

Yeah.

447

:

We learned a little bit more about John

Wick in this setup as he loves his car.

448

:

A 1969 Ford Mustang Mach 1 that

he often takes out to the track

449

:

and he drives fast and recklessly.

450

:

It's a fucking awesome looking car.

451

:

It's so great.

452

:

Again, I always think about it.

453

:

This is our show as we go off on tangents.

454

:

And I always think of other movies.

455

:

When I saw his love for this car, I

couldn't help but think of Josh Brolin

456

:

in American Gangster, how he loves that

Shelby he drives, and Denzel, when he

457

:

gets pissed at him, he gets that car

blown up, like he blows up his car!

458

:

Like, it's kinda like, that's what

you do to piss somebody off, right?

459

:

Alright, so, inciting incident.

460

:

starts at the 10 minute mark when we meet

ISF and his two closest friends, Victor

461

:

and Gregory, as they stumble upon John

filling up his Mustang at the gas station.

462

:

They are particularly.

463

:

ISF because he becomes

interested in the vehicle and

464

:

gets uncomfortably close to it.

465

:

And John in a weird way

for a stranger, right?

466

:

Like he leans into his car and

he's like, Oh, it looks nice.

467

:

You know, like if I'm at a gas station and

somebody does that to me, I'm like, dude,

468

:

Get away, you're like uncomfortably close.

469

:

Also we established

here a few other things.

470

:

ISF and his friends are Russian and they

speak the language casually, but John also

471

:

speaks Russian and he understands them.

472

:

That catches them off guard, but

we learn a lot about John here.

473

:

He speaks Russian.

474

:

Right?

475

:

Catalyst, 14 minutes into the film,

Daisy's unsettling barks wakes up

476

:

John to intruders in his house.

477

:

It is Iosef and his friends,

they came for the car.

478

:

However, the unthinkable happens

as they overpower John with

479

:

bats and sadly, kill his dog.

480

:

It's very sad the moment when he wakes

up and he sees this blood trail lead,

481

:

like there's a line, like the floor

has a, It has a blood trail on it.

482

:

There's no other way to describe

it leading up to the dog.

483

:

Chris: Well, the dog, that

implies the dog crawled to him.

484

:

Yes.

485

:

As it was wounded, it crawled

to be near him to comfort him,

486

:

Jerome: right?

487

:

Because when, when the, the

assailants were attacking

488

:

the dog, you hear it yelping.

489

:

Chris: Yeah.

490

:

Jerome: It's, it's at least 20 feet away.

491

:

Chris: Oh yeah.

492

:

Yeah.

493

:

Yeah.

494

:

Jerome: Right.

495

:

So when he wakes up and the dog

is laying next to him and the

496

:

blood trail is leading 20 feet.

497

:

Yeah.

498

:

Chris: I was like, Oh my

God, dude, I don't even

499

:

Jerome: have a dog.

500

:

And I wanted to murder everyone.

501

:

It's so bad.

502

:

All right.

503

:

Debate begins.

504

:

John wakes up to the dead dog.

505

:

He buries her and spends the next

day cleaning while having flashbacks

506

:

of his wife and the clear and

obvious connection the dog has to

507

:

being a symbolic wife replacement.

508

:

I say clear and obvious because they.

509

:

They commit a cardinal screenwriting

sin later regarding this, and

510

:

I'll get to it when it happens.

511

:

Uh, About this time the criminals

try to sell the car that they stole.

512

:

When their usual fence to chop

the cars they steal, Aurelio sees

513

:

the car and he obviously becomes

fearful because he recognizes it.

514

:

He knows it's John Wick's.

515

:

He wants nothing to do with it.

516

:

Naturally, John goes to see Aurelio

because that's where you take stolen

517

:

cars and he needs a replacement.

518

:

Aurelio pretty much tells him,

dude, I had nothing to do with it.

519

:

They were here.

520

:

I fucking told him to get out of here.

521

:

But I'll give you a car as a replacement.

522

:

Aurelio knows he doesn't

want to get killed.

523

:

Chris: Yeah.

524

:

Jerome: Then we're introduced

to Vigo, IOSF's father, and

525

:

clearly the Russian mob boss.

526

:

And his number two, Avi.

527

:

When he discovers that his son stole

John wick's car and killed his dog He's

528

:

obviously worried too and has to educate

his son and Avi about who John wick really

529

:

is We're gonna get to more of this later.

530

:

I just kind of want to go through the

beats right now Yeah, this is a big part.

531

:

I am gonna talk about later, but let's

just get through the beats as we go break

532

:

into two like unforgiven the break into

two isn't so much of a huge impactful

533

:

scene and a lot of these ex killers coming

out of retirement, these are mental,

534

:

emotional decisions, and when John takes

a sledgehammer to his basement floor to

535

:

pull out all his old guns and money, we

can assume he's made the decision, right?

536

:

Yeah.

537

:

He's gonna go after them.

538

:

So knowing he may have to go after the

boss too, As well as the sun, right?

539

:

If he tries to protect his son this

is all intercut with Vigo, by the

540

:

way, educating his son about John

and around the 25 minute mark He's

541

:

telling his son about who John Wick is.

542

:

Two minutes later, he calls John.

543

:

And he's like, Hey, buddy, how's it going?

544

:

You know, he's trying to get, he's

trying to get a feel for things, right?

545

:

Like just so you know, that was my son.

546

:

I'm sorry about everything.

547

:

But, and John just hangs up

on him and that worries him.

548

:

Obviously he turns to his number two

Avi and Avi says, what did he say?

549

:

And Vigo goes, enough

550

:

Chris: I know that's great.

551

:

Jerome: He knows it's on now and

he tells Avi, task your crew.

552

:

And Avi says, how many?

553

:

And Viggo goes, how many do you have?

554

:

Chris: I love it.

555

:

He doesn't even say a word.

556

:

How much, what did he say?

557

:

Enough.

558

:

Jerome: I know he said

enough by saying nothing.

559

:

Right.

560

:

Yeah.

561

:

Alright, I had to finish that whiskey.

562

:

Woo!

563

:

Damn, that shit's a ball kicker!

564

:

Alright.

565

:

B Story.

566

:

Here Alright, so I mentioned

an Unforgiven episode.

567

:

I went in I saw B Story and

I was about to get all mad.

568

:

They actually do it right.

569

:

It's Ned.

570

:

The B Story here This is one of

the issues I have with this script.

571

:

There is no clear B story

established at this point.

572

:

The only argument for a

B story would be Marcus.

573

:

Who not only was already

introduced, which is fine.

574

:

We've seen B stories, you

know, introduced early before.

575

:

I can't remember what movie we talked

about, but the B story was introduced

576

:

like right in the first scene.

577

:

But anyway, that's fine.

578

:

But when he's reintroduced in the

early second act, he's hired by Vigo.

579

:

To kill John.

580

:

So we immediately turn

on Marcus as a traitor.

581

:

As an audience member, right?

582

:

We don't we don't know

what's going to happen later.

583

:

But at the moment, we're

like, oh, fuck, John.

584

:

Marcus is a traitor.

585

:

And, you know, we don't learn

that he's actually going to

586

:

protect John until later.

587

:

But once that is established, that

he's a friend trying to help, you

588

:

could argue he would Could be the one

driving John to his spiritual goal,

589

:

his peace, but the role is the B story.

590

:

That's way too late.

591

:

You know what I mean?

592

:

There's not much

593

:

Chris: development there.

594

:

And

595

:

Jerome: yeah, so it's like, and

again, we're going to get up to the

596

:

list of my issues with this movie.

597

:

Marcus is one of them.

598

:

Funding games, Vigo tries to

head off the issue and puts a

599

:

hit out on John at his own house.

600

:

Naturally, it doesn't go well.

601

:

As the bad guys John dispatches all of

them relatively easily one at a time.

602

:

He then calls a very convenient

cleaning service for the

603

:

mobsters to clean up his house.

604

:

I don't know if you know this, but the

guy he calls, I think his name is charlie.

605

:

You know who that guy is?

606

:

He's been in a lot of movies.

607

:

Chris: I don't know if you know him.

608

:

Let me see.

609

:

Jerome: He's In his younger

days is David Patrick Kelly.

610

:

I think his name is he was in

remember that movie dreamscape?

611

:

With Dennis Quaid back in the 80s.

612

:

Chris: Oh my gosh.

613

:

He

614

:

Jerome: was the villain in that movie.

615

:

He was the villain in

the movie The Warriors.

616

:

He was oh shit, what else was he in?

617

:

He was, he was, he was one of the

bad guys in Adventures of Ford

618

:

Fairlane with Andrew Dice Clay.

619

:

Chris: What, what, what

was his name in the movie?

620

:

Jerome: In which, in this movie?

621

:

Chris: Yeah.

622

:

Jerome: I think it's Charlie.

623

:

I think his name was Charlie.

624

:

I'm

625

:

Chris: trying to find him.

626

:

Jerome: The actor's name is

David Patrick Kelly, I think.

627

:

Chris: Yeah, yeah, he's

got a ton of stuff.

628

:

Jerome: So anyway, so he calls him,

and it's great because he's like, I

629

:

want to make a reservation for 12.

630

:

And at the time, as an audience

member, you're like, I don't know,

631

:

what, what the fuck is he doing?

632

:

He's calling for restaurant reservations?

633

:

But then these guys show up

and you're like, oh, I get

634

:

it, it's a cleaning service.

635

:

Yeah.

636

:

And, and what's also funny about

this, and I did like this part,

637

:

that while I'm watching this happen,

I'm Not the cleaning service, when

638

:

I'm watching the killings happen.

639

:

They're smashing windows in

his house, they're smashing his

640

:

furniture, there's blood everywhere.

641

:

I remember thinking, he's

gonna have to leave that house.

642

:

Because it's unlivable now, right?

643

:

Chris: Yeah,

644

:

Jerome: but when the cleaning service

comes They make it like nothing

645

:

ever happened and I was like, well,

fuck that was convenient, right?

646

:

Like i'm gonna let

647

:

Chris: you get through the beats But I

want to comment on on the cleaning service

648

:

and the whole back culture of the killers.

649

:

Yeah

650

:

Jerome: Well, I don't have

anything else on that.

651

:

So if you want to do it,

652

:

Chris: well just it was kind of a a clever

technique, I guess, to write this story

653

:

where there's this whole backstory of this

culture of all these assassins and they

654

:

have this, this gold currency that they

trade whenever they need something, right?

655

:

That cleaning service, a room,

you know a surgeon, they all

656

:

trade in these gold coins.

657

:

It was clever because

nothing was explained.

658

:

If they just, yeah, they just

kind of like push forward and

659

:

you're like, oh, oh, okay.

660

:

So this is, this is a.

661

:

You're catching up to the story.

662

:

Basically there's something going on.

663

:

Yeah.

664

:

Jerome: When WIC opens up that case that

was under the concrete, you see the left

665

:

side is all his old guns and the right

side is filled with those gold coins.

666

:

Chris: Yeah.

667

:

Jerome: So, and I am going to

touch on that a little bit later,

668

:

but yeah, I liked that aspect

that he calls a cleaning service.

669

:

He calls it, make, I want to

make a reservation for 12.

670

:

That way he tells them exactly how

many bodies they need to clean up.

671

:

Right.

672

:

So I did like that.

673

:

I thought that was a funny one.

674

:

All right.

675

:

41 minutes in, we meet Wednesday.

676

:

at the Continental Hotel, which is kind

of like a way station for assassins.

677

:

Chris: Yeah.

678

:

Jerome: And the rule is you just

can't conduct business here.

679

:

You can't conduct business here.

680

:

That's the only rule.

681

:

Winston runs the place and he gives

a great line of dialogue that feeds

682

:

into John's spiritual arc theme.

683

:

He first asks John, have

you returned to the fold?

684

:

John replies, just visiting.

685

:

Chris: Right.

686

:

Jerome: Still fighting his

spiritual goal, obviously, right?

687

:

Right.

688

:

And finding his real piece.

689

:

And then Winston says, this is

a quote, have you thought of,

690

:

have you thought this through?

691

:

I mean, chewed down to the bone.

692

:

You got out once you dip so much

as a pinky back into the pond, you

693

:

may well find something reaches out

and drags you back into the depths.

694

:

Yeah.

695

:

End quote.

696

:

Winston eventually does tell

John where he can find IOSF.

697

:

And that uh, And, and that

battle leads to the midpoint.

698

:

So here we are at the midpoint

scene, the battle at the red circle.

699

:

By the way, in that part, we meet

Addie, the bartender, and she's only

700

:

got like that scene, I think, isn't it?

701

:

Is that the only scene she's in?

702

:

Chris: I think so.

703

:

I

704

:

Jerome: think maybe she shows up at

the end, maybe, I don't know, but

705

:

that's really her only real big scene.

706

:

And it is fair to note that in the

scene that she's in and she sees john

707

:

for the first time She gives him a

kiss and she says i've never seen you

708

:

like this and he says what and she goes

vulnerable So again, that's you know

709

:

tying into his Emotional back and forth.

710

:

Is he back in or is he still gonna be the

nice guy that his wife created, right?

711

:

Chris: Right, right.

712

:

Jerome: All right midpoint scene the

battle at the red circle This is john's

713

:

false victory because he finds isf finally

and although he takes out victor One of

714

:

the men who was involved in killing his

dog and stealing his car isf gets away

715

:

Despite a moment where john is pointing

his gun at him and has him dead to rights.

716

:

He doesn't shoot You More on that later.

717

:

That's one of my issues.

718

:

Anyway.

719

:

Bad Guys closing in.

720

:

Now officially in the second act of Act

2, a recovering John gets a disturbing

721

:

wake up call when Marcus fires a bullet

through his window and hits his pillow.

722

:

Essentially waking him up to fight.

723

:

The oncoming assassin who happens

to be his old friend Perkins Who is

724

:

knowingly breaking rule number one

of the continental by the way, you're

725

:

not supposed to conduct business

there That's what she's doing.

726

:

It's ms.

727

:

Chris: Perkins.

728

:

Jerome: Sorry ms.

729

:

Perkins but god, she's

so beautiful, isn't she?

730

:

But she's doing it for the two

million downy for two million dollar

731

:

bounty that vigo put on john still

She's breaking rule number one

732

:

Chris: and didn't he say he would

double it if she broke the rule?

733

:

Jerome: Yeah.

734

:

He was going to give her 4

million to break the rule.

735

:

John takes out the Russian church that was

holding all the money, business, blackmail

736

:

info, everything for the Russian mob.

737

:

Even the gold coins are in there.

738

:

Chris: He

739

:

Jerome: burns it all down.

740

:

And then he goes up on a roof and

he waits for everyone to gather and

741

:

collect there and respond, right.

742

:

To see who's there.

743

:

And then he starts pegging them all off.

744

:

Now the all is losses.

745

:

When this plan seems foolproof.

746

:

Of course, nothing ever is.

747

:

He goes down there and although

he's taking out people left and

748

:

right, he's trying to get Vigo and

ISF at the one hour, six minute

749

:

mark, he's knocked out by a car that

hits him and he's taken hostage.

750

:

Now, normally this would be it for him.

751

:

It should be right if you're

that afraid of this guy once

752

:

he's down like that you kill him

753

:

Chris: Yeah,

754

:

Jerome: but they don't

because it's a movie right?

755

:

They just take him hostage.

756

:

What the fuck dude another half an

757

:

Chris: hour to fill

758

:

Jerome: Well, no Again, we're gonna get

to my list of problems and that's one of

759

:

them They should have just put a bullet

in his head right there But they don't

760

:

they tie him up and they put him in now

that we get to the dark night of the soul

761

:

Captive john considers his next move.

762

:

He has You know, if he has one.

763

:

Tied to a chair and being prepped for

execution, Viggo is face to face with

764

:

him and adds an element to the theme.

765

:

With several lines like, quote,

And then you left, and the way you

766

:

got out, lying to yourself that the

past held no sway over the future.

767

:

But in the end, the lot of us are

rewarded, sarcastically, for our misdeeds.

768

:

Which is why God took your

wife and unleashed you upon me.

769

:

This life, this life follows you.

770

:

It clings to you infecting

everyone who comes close to you.

771

:

You are cursed.

772

:

You and I, end quote.

773

:

A lot of that harks back

to unforgiven, doesn't it?

774

:

Yeah.

775

:

As I talked about, about

how the past, right.

776

:

And again, in that movie, William Money.

777

:

He didn't suffer from his past.

778

:

He was never he was never punished

for his sins until Ned dies.

779

:

Right?

780

:

Right.

781

:

So in here, he's saying your sins

where God took your wife, right?

782

:

And my sin.

783

:

He unleashed you upon me because he

know he knows the second the second

784

:

in the first act he finds out his son

Killed John wicks dog and stole his car.

785

:

He knows he's going to die He tries

every moment to get out of it,

786

:

but he knows what's gonna happen.

787

:

Chris: Yeah,

788

:

Jerome: right.

789

:

He just knows John has his retort which is

him grabbing a hold of his spiritual goal.

790

:

Again, more on the timing

of that a little bit later.

791

:

And while I love the second part of

this statement, I hate the first part.

792

:

And this is the part I

was talking about earlier.

793

:

When he says, this is a quote, When

Helen died, I lost everything, until

794

:

that dog arrived on my doorstep.

795

:

A final gift from my wife.

796

:

In that moment, I received some semblance

of hope, an opportunity to grieve unalone.

797

:

And your son took that from me, stole

that from me, killed that from me.

798

:

I hate that line and I'll tell you why.

799

:

We don't know, we didn't

need to hear him say it.

800

:

Yeah, we already,

801

:

Chris: yeah, we already knew it.

802

:

Yeah, we

803

:

Jerome: know that.

804

:

I hate when movies try to

nail stuff on the head.

805

:

Yeah.

806

:

And say the obvious thing.

807

:

Like, don't say the obvious thing.

808

:

We know the obvious thing.

809

:

We know this.

810

:

Viggo knows it.

811

:

Everyone knows it.

812

:

In fact, Viggo wouldn't have reacted

that way if he didn't know it.

813

:

Right,

814

:

Chris: right, right.

815

:

Jerome: So, the mystical spiritualism

attached to the dog is obvious, and

816

:

it's diminished when a character has

to spell it out for the audience.

817

:

Right, right.

818

:

It's clear what the dog represents, okay?

819

:

This line is unnecessary, and I hate it.

820

:

It might be the worst line in the movie.

821

:

But, in fact, even Viggo

scoffs at it when he says it!

822

:

Chris: Yeah.

823

:

Jerome: He says it, and

even Viggo's like, Ugh.

824

:

I wonder if the actor was

scoffing at it, not the character.

825

:

That's how bad that line is.

826

:

But thankfully it's followed up by

John's spiritual gold declaration,

827

:

which might be my favorite.

828

:

favorite line of dialogue in the whole

film when he says quote People keep asking

829

:

me if I'm back and I haven't really had

an answer, but now yeah I'm thinking I'm

830

:

back so you can either hand over your son

or you can die screaming alongside him

831

:

I'm in my recliner with scotch in

the hand And I'm watching that scene

832

:

and when he gives the first line,

I'm like, Oh dude, no, don't, we no.

833

:

But then when that line happens, I

was like, I almost jumped out of my

834

:

recliner, like kill these fuckers.

835

:

You know what I mean?

836

:

Like, I'm all about it at that point.

837

:

So that they redeem themselves with

a great second part of that dialogue.

838

:

All right.

839

:

Break into three.

840

:

While suffocating because the

henchman put a bag over his head,

841

:

John is saved by Marcus once again.

842

:

He gains the upper hand on Vigo

who can't believe he's alive.

843

:

He's like, almost like in shock

that he made it out of that.

844

:

And he's forced to give up his son

at the one hour, 14 minute mark.

845

:

I say forced cause that's in his

nature, self preservation, right?

846

:

Any normal father would protect

his son and take that bullet.

847

:

And just say, no, you'll have to kill me.

848

:

I'm not going to tell you where my son is.

849

:

You'll have to kill me.

850

:

Oh no, not Vigo.

851

:

Vigo, Vigo.

852

:

It's like an almost anti

save the cat moment.

853

:

Chris: Yeah.

854

:

Right.

855

:

Jerome: He's cooking

the cat at this point.

856

:

I'll tell you where my son is.

857

:

He's at this spot and you can

meet him between five and eight.

858

:

You know what I mean?

859

:

Like, yeah, he basically.

860

:

Yeah.

861

:

All right.

862

:

Five point finale.

863

:

Gathering the team.

864

:

John arrives at the safe house in

Brooklyn where Homeboy is, where IOSF is.

865

:

And he gears up.

866

:

While we are intercut with Vigo smoking

pot seemingly to get over what he's

867

:

just done Like he's in his office.

868

:

He's like I just gave up my son.

869

:

I better smoke some weed, right?

870

:

Storming the castle john takes out

everyone including gregory and of course

871

:

iosef relatively abruptly before making

his escape once free of everything he

872

:

thanks marcus for his help now before

we move on to the five point family

873

:

Just want to make a little note A little

point here, he kills Iosef so quickly

874

:

and swiftly, like he shoots him in the

belly and then he falls and as he's

875

:

walking towards him, which in a lot

of the posters for this movie is that

876

:

poster of him walking towards Iosef.

877

:

Iosef starts to say, He his line

was supposed to be it's a it was

878

:

just a fucking dog He only gets

to fucking he's like it's just a

879

:

fucking and then john wick kills him.

880

:

Yeah You know that there were

reddit comments that were

881

:

like that was too humane.

882

:

He should have tortured him first.

883

:

Chris: Oh my god

884

:

Jerome: I know That's how

much Dogs are important, man.

885

:

Chris: Like

886

:

Jerome: people wanted ISF to

suffer more, but anyway, okay.

887

:

Hightower surprise.

888

:

Cause everything at this point,

everything's worked out good.

889

:

Again, he goes to the bridge and

he thanks Marcus for his help.

890

:

Hightower surprises.

891

:

Perkins sees this move by Marcus

rats him out to Vigo and Marcus has

892

:

him taken and beaten and killed.

893

:

Right.

894

:

All right.

895

:

Debate begins again.

896

:

A lot like unforgiven when Ned died.

897

:

He accomplished his mission,

he could just go home.

898

:

Just like William Money

could have just gone home.

899

:

But Ned died and here Marcus died.

900

:

So now there's a debate begins.

901

:

John, you know, he did what he wanted.

902

:

He took out ISF, but once he

finds out about Marcus, he

903

:

has to make that decision.

904

:

Does he want revenge?

905

:

And I'm sure you can guess

where it goes from there.

906

:

Execution of the new plan.

907

:

John takes out everyone.

908

:

And I mean, everyone that's

left, including Vigo.

909

:

He even allows himself, this is

interesting in the fight he has with Vigo.

910

:

He allows himself to get.

911

:

In order to get the upper hand on Vigo.

912

:

Right?

913

:

If you watch that fight scene,

he couldn't get his hand free.

914

:

And he's like, oh fuck it, I'll let

him stab me so I can get my hand free.

915

:

And then I'll be able to kill him.

916

:

And he does!

917

:

It worked and he kills Vigo.

918

:

Uh, Closing image.

919

:

where the movie started.

920

:

A wounded Jadwik is

bleeding and near death.

921

:

He comes out of the car and we

find out that the building his

922

:

car crashed into was an animal

shelter and he saves a shelter dog.

923

:

To replace Daisy and he walks off

life with a new dog, a new semblance

924

:

of hope and to grieve on a loan.

925

:

Chris: Yeah, perfect.

926

:

Closing it.

927

:

Notice the type of dog he gets though.

928

:

Jerome: It's like a pit bull.

929

:

Chris: That fucker ain't

going down without a fight.

930

:

Well, I think it was symbolic that.

931

:

Yeah.

932

:

He, he, he's, yeah.

933

:

That he is back.

934

:

He's back.

935

:

He's back.

936

:

Yeah.

937

:

It, it wasn't a, this wasn't a

little precious, little beagle.

938

:

Yeah.

939

:

Now, I, I get it pit bull lovers

are gonna be mad at me, I mean,

940

:

you treat a pit bull, right.

941

:

It's gonna be a beautiful dog.

942

:

Jerome: Yeah.

943

:

And I've heard that argument.

944

:

I've heard that.

945

:

I have heard that argument.

946

:

Chris: But the symbol.

947

:

The symbol, everyone

knows that's a killer.

948

:

Jerome: Yeah.

949

:

And again, and I get it.

950

:

I've heard that, that, that argument

that stopped making the pit bull a

951

:

villain, you know, it's all in how

they're raised and how they're treated.

952

:

I had a roommate in North Hollywood

when I was renting a room out

953

:

of my buddy Blake's house.

954

:

She had an American bulldog,

which looks a lot like a pit.

955

:

But if this thing was muscular when

it stood it looked like Schwarzenegger

956

:

But this thing had a heart on

it like it's fur It's it was a

957

:

white dog, but it had brown spots.

958

:

One of the spots on its back

was in the shape of a heart

959

:

Chris: Oh my gosh, and

960

:

Jerome: this dog by the way, the dog's

name was lovey and this dog Was so

961

:

lovable like and it's true It's all how

you treat a dog and how you raise a dog.

962

:

There is no dog that's angry all

the time Except for Chihuahuas,

963

:

but we're not going to get to that.

964

:

But, but, but so yeah, so I get that.

965

:

It's unfair to say he got a pit

because the pit is deadly, but I,

966

:

I agree with what you're saying.

967

:

It's the symbol,

968

:

Chris: it was a cute dog.

969

:

It was a, you know, it looked like

a young, you know, young dog puppy.

970

:

Yeah.

971

:

And you know, but yeah, it wasn't

a little, it wasn't, it wasn't like

972

:

a harmless little, little beagle.

973

:

Jerome: Yeah, it was a people.

974

:

All right, here we go.

975

:

I'm going to give you

my list of plot issues.

976

:

All right, here we go.

977

:

Hang on, hang on.

978

:

I got to grab another beer.

979

:

Chris: I just poured some more whiskey.

980

:

Jerome: All right.

981

:

Plot issues.

982

:

There's a stark difference in quality

writing between Unforgiven and John Wick.

983

:

To be fair, Unforgiven built the

world around them of simplicity.

984

:

They had horses to travel.

985

:

There were no phones.

986

:

Stories spread by word of mouth.

987

:

Technology didn't exist.

988

:

It was at a minimum.

989

:

They didn't have NyQuil, they had

whiskey, et cetera, et cetera.

990

:

And John Wick exists in our world,

the world of stylistic eye candy

991

:

and technology that lends to issues

with the developments, right?

992

:

Like we, I get that.

993

:

I'm, I'm going to say right off the bat.

994

:

That I acknowledge that difference.

995

:

That it was easier, quote

unquote, to write Unforgiven

996

:

than probably writing John Wick.

997

:

However, here we go.

998

:

Number one.

999

:

This is sort of an important plot issue.

:

00:45:37,988 --> 00:45:39,308

At least for me, alright?

:

00:45:39,648 --> 00:45:41,358

Maybe not for everybody

else, but at least for me.

:

00:45:42,153 --> 00:45:47,263

If he truly has given up on

his old life, why buy or own

:

00:45:47,263 --> 00:45:48,793

a car that attracts attention?

:

00:45:49,253 --> 00:45:53,593

If an ex assassin wants to disappear

into normal life, why does he even

:

00:45:53,593 --> 00:45:55,463

live in the same fucking town?

:

00:45:56,163 --> 00:45:58,233

Unforgiven doesn't make this error.

:

00:45:58,493 --> 00:46:01,353

William Money did all his old

school killings in Missouri.

:

00:46:01,353 --> 00:46:03,993

After all, he's known as

William Money out of Missouri.

:

00:46:04,353 --> 00:46:08,343

But when he meets and marries Claudia He

finds a little ranch out in the middle

:

00:46:08,343 --> 00:46:11,443

of nowhere in Kansas to start a new life.

:

00:46:11,903 --> 00:46:19,133

That's why he's startled at first when

the Schofield kids shows up and even

:

00:46:19,133 --> 00:46:21,883

tells him, he's like, I thought maybe

you were someone that came to kill me

:

00:46:21,893 --> 00:46:23,453

for something I did in the old days.

:

00:46:24,073 --> 00:46:28,533

John wick stays in the same town,

has the same name, has a car.

:

00:46:28,543 --> 00:46:32,183

Everyone knows, which to me seems foolish.

:

00:46:32,463 --> 00:46:37,143

I mean, I mean, if you're somebody

who's made enemies over the years.

:

00:46:37,813 --> 00:46:41,963

Everyone treats him like

he's the fucking prom king.

:

00:46:42,123 --> 00:46:42,213

I

:

00:46:42,213 --> 00:46:45,623

Chris: thought it was funny that he used

his real name when he went to the hotel.

:

00:46:46,513 --> 00:46:51,868

Jerome: Yeah, I mean like, Like everyone

seems to love him and they want him

:

00:46:51,868 --> 00:46:55,688

to come back like everyone knows him

and knows where he is knows his car

:

00:46:55,948 --> 00:46:58,628

That's it just seems weird to me, right?

:

00:46:58,688 --> 00:47:03,258

I just didn't buy any of that number

two since we're on the subject

:

00:47:03,258 --> 00:47:08,178

major plot point number two How

the fuck does Iosef the boss's

:

00:47:08,188 --> 00:47:11,418

son or Avi the boss's right hand?

:

00:47:11,568 --> 00:47:13,648

Have no idea who John wick is

:

00:47:13,898 --> 00:47:15,938

Chris: Yeah, right, if

he's such a big deal.

:

00:47:16,038 --> 00:47:18,438

Jerome: Right, he worked

for them in the past.

:

00:47:18,438 --> 00:47:20,298

He worked for them for years.

:

00:47:20,668 --> 00:47:24,308

And he wasn't out of the game

for a decade like William Money.

:

00:47:24,438 --> 00:47:26,708

He's only been out of the

game for a couple of years.

:

00:47:27,468 --> 00:47:30,708

Wick has been domesticated for

a couple of years, fine, I get

:

00:47:30,708 --> 00:47:33,848

that, but John knows who Iosef is.

:

00:47:34,248 --> 00:47:36,568

How does Iosef not know

who the fuck John is?

:

00:47:36,578 --> 00:47:36,888

Chris: Yeah.

:

00:47:37,718 --> 00:47:39,448

Jerome: Plot issue number three.

:

00:47:39,648 --> 00:47:44,518

Speaking of Avi, he is the number

two to his boss, his henchman, his

:

00:47:44,518 --> 00:47:48,278

number one henchman, who is the

leader of all the other henchmen.

:

00:47:49,003 --> 00:47:53,543

And he yet seems to have a very

weak stomach for this line of work.

:

00:47:54,133 --> 00:47:59,173

When Viggo is hitting his son

and excruciating uncomfortable

:

00:47:59,173 --> 00:48:03,173

like, he, I mean, he acts like

he's watching a snuff film.

:

00:48:03,533 --> 00:48:06,083

He's just like, oh my god,

ugh, do you want me to leave?

:

00:48:06,393 --> 00:48:07,793

Ugh, I can't watch this.

:

00:48:07,813 --> 00:48:10,633

Like, dude, you're the number two.

:

00:48:10,803 --> 00:48:13,293

You can't take me beating on my son.

:

00:48:14,053 --> 00:48:17,263

In fact, every time Viggo wants

to get rough, there's a shot

:

00:48:17,263 --> 00:48:18,943

of Avi not taking it well.

:

00:48:19,573 --> 00:48:21,123

What kind of henchman is this?

:

00:48:21,873 --> 00:48:25,623

Number four, plot issue number four, and

we're gonna stay on Avi for a minute.

:

00:48:26,793 --> 00:48:30,143

He doesn't speak or understand Russian.

:

00:48:33,003 --> 00:48:36,443

Does he know who his boss is?

:

00:48:36,443 --> 00:48:40,083

Why wouldn't Viggo, why would

Viggo even hire this douche?

:

00:48:40,723 --> 00:48:42,903

Why can't, he can't speak their language.

:

00:48:42,903 --> 00:48:44,633

Why wouldn't he hire somebody?

:

00:48:44,648 --> 00:48:47,068

Chris: Because he's mayhem.

:

00:48:48,328 --> 00:48:49,388

Jerome: Because he's mayhem.

:

00:48:50,078 --> 00:48:55,258

And they use it as comical bits like you

know, he's like, Oh, Vigo, speak Russian.

:

00:48:55,258 --> 00:48:56,998

You know, I don't speak English.

:

00:48:56,998 --> 00:48:58,138

You know, I don't understand Russian.

:

00:48:58,498 --> 00:49:02,238

But to me, I'm sitting there again

in my recliner scotch in hand and I'm

:

00:49:02,238 --> 00:49:04,498

like, why the fuck is he the number two?

:

00:49:05,188 --> 00:49:06,428

He has a weak stomach.

:

00:49:06,878 --> 00:49:08,778

And he doesn't understand the language.

:

00:49:08,788 --> 00:49:11,188

He should go back to his

fucking all state commercials.

:

00:49:12,118 --> 00:49:12,708

All right.

:

00:49:12,878 --> 00:49:17,028

Plot point number five, the

Continental it's comical by the

:

00:49:17,028 --> 00:49:19,628

way, it's a home for killers, right?

:

00:49:20,028 --> 00:49:22,478

A hotel that's made for killers.

:

00:49:22,488 --> 00:49:26,598

The hotel clerk is very helpful, but

when he learns there's a 2 million

:

00:49:26,868 --> 00:49:33,423

bounty on John, he doesn't bother to

tell him he doesn't say stay clear

:

00:49:33,423 --> 00:49:35,193

of all these other people for hire.

:

00:49:35,523 --> 00:49:35,793

Chris: Yeah.

:

00:49:35,853 --> 00:49:38,143

Jerome: Like that hot ass miss Perkins

:

00:49:38,143 --> 00:49:39,733

Chris: who are staying at this hotel.

:

00:49:40,103 --> 00:49:40,243

Jerome: Yeah.

:

00:49:40,243 --> 00:49:44,723

Who are staying here, including

miss Perkins who wants your

:

00:49:44,743 --> 00:49:45,763

blood more than your cock.

:

00:49:46,383 --> 00:49:50,203

Chris: He could have gave my heads up the,

Hey there's a motel six down the street.

:

00:49:50,683 --> 00:49:50,823

Jerome: Yeah.

:

00:49:50,823 --> 00:49:54,983

Like, I mean, I get that there's not

supposed to be business conducted there.

:

00:49:55,908 --> 00:49:59,858

There's an open bounty on a guy

who's staying in a place filled

:

00:50:00,138 --> 00:50:02,298

with people who fill bounties.

:

00:50:03,338 --> 00:50:05,298

Why would he stay there?

:

00:50:05,848 --> 00:50:08,108

And why wouldn't anyone tell him?

:

00:50:08,108 --> 00:50:08,648

Chris: Yeah,

:

00:50:09,408 --> 00:50:13,148

Jerome: all right plot point number

six Marcus goes through all this

:

00:50:13,148 --> 00:50:15,528

elaborate sabotage to protect John.

:

00:50:15,728 --> 00:50:22,408

At one point, firing a bullet into the

pillow next to him so that he wakes up and

:

00:50:22,408 --> 00:50:25,178

can fight Perkins, a would be assassin.

:

00:50:25,438 --> 00:50:26,908

Here's an idea, Marcus.

:

00:50:27,523 --> 00:50:28,803

Shoot Perkins!

:

00:50:29,433 --> 00:50:32,215

Like, why does he shoot the pillow?

:

00:50:32,215 --> 00:50:36,743

Like, why did he just wait for

Perkins to come in and kill her?

:

00:50:37,103 --> 00:50:38,833

Like, as if, like, what?

:

00:50:38,923 --> 00:50:39,333

Chris: Yeah, right.

:

00:50:40,643 --> 00:50:43,093

Jerome: Alright, plot point number seven.

:

00:50:43,373 --> 00:50:46,363

And probably the biggest

plot issue of them all.

:

00:50:47,173 --> 00:50:49,653

Wick needs Marcus to survive.

:

00:50:50,123 --> 00:50:52,613

Marcus saves his ass twice.

:

00:50:53,053 --> 00:50:55,883

Once from Perkins, and the

other from Viggo's henchmen.

:

00:50:56,643 --> 00:51:01,383

Doesn't sound like the myth of

somebody necessarily to fear.

:

00:51:01,543 --> 00:51:06,083

Without Marcus's interference, Wick

would have been dead two times over.

:

00:51:06,783 --> 00:51:09,203

Another aspect Unforgiven got right.

:

00:51:09,543 --> 00:51:15,023

While Ned might be there to stitch his

wounds, William Money never is down

:

00:51:15,023 --> 00:51:17,523

dead to rights and never needs saving.

:

00:51:17,683 --> 00:51:19,693

He crawls himself out of little bills.

:

00:51:19,733 --> 00:51:21,773

Yeah, even when his gun jams.

:

00:51:22,128 --> 00:51:25,788

Yeah, he strengthens up, gets

back on his game, and in the

:

00:51:25,788 --> 00:51:29,658

end, he walks straight into the

lion's mouth and pulls up a chair.

:

00:51:31,208 --> 00:51:32,408

Plot point number eight.

:

00:51:32,408 --> 00:51:37,538

Speaking of dead to rights, Wick has

Iosef in his sights at the red circle.

:

00:51:38,088 --> 00:51:42,358

In that shootout at the midpoint scene,

he has his gun drawn, and they lock eyes.

:

00:51:42,928 --> 00:51:46,318

And Wick decides not to shoot.

:

00:51:47,128 --> 00:51:47,308

Why?

:

00:51:47,828 --> 00:51:48,808

Chris: Yeah, yeah.

:

00:51:48,808 --> 00:51:49,118

Jerome: What?

:

00:51:49,118 --> 00:51:49,808

I mean, what?

:

00:51:49,938 --> 00:51:53,648

I went on Reddit to look this up

and a bunch of comments were like,

:

00:51:53,858 --> 00:51:57,318

'Cause it's a movie and it's way

too early to kill the bad guy.

:

00:51:57,448 --> 00:51:58,368

Well, you know what?

:

00:51:58,478 --> 00:51:59,848

Then that's shit writing.

:

00:51:59,968 --> 00:52:00,458

Yeah, right.

:

00:52:00,458 --> 00:52:02,158

And it's not, and it's not realistic.

:

00:52:02,168 --> 00:52:03,928

Chris: Should have showed

me something different then.

:

00:52:04,388 --> 00:52:05,408

Jerome: Yeah, exactly.

:

00:52:05,408 --> 00:52:09,218

I mean, it would have been better if

like, he couldn't get his eye on him.

:

00:52:09,218 --> 00:52:09,638

You know what I mean?

:

00:52:09,638 --> 00:52:12,538

Like, he kept, he kept sneaking

just out of the way and I

:

00:52:12,538 --> 00:52:13,958

can't quite get my gun on him.

:

00:52:15,328 --> 00:52:16,808

That's a horrible scene.

:

00:52:16,818 --> 00:52:20,868

He looks right at him, the guy that

killed his dog and stole his car, and

:

00:52:20,878 --> 00:52:22,218

he just shoots a henchman instead.

:

00:52:22,218 --> 00:52:23,838

Chris: Yeah, I thought the same thing.

:

00:52:24,388 --> 00:52:26,478

Jerome: I was like, what the fuck, man?

:

00:52:26,628 --> 00:52:27,598

why didn't he shoot him?

:

00:52:28,468 --> 00:52:31,668

So these a lot of these

elements, Unforgiven gets right.

:

00:52:31,938 --> 00:52:33,208

And John Wick gets wrong.

:

00:52:33,978 --> 00:52:35,278

Now we're going to move into a segment.

:

00:52:35,278 --> 00:52:36,388

We're going to get off of her.

:

00:52:36,388 --> 00:52:39,628

All you fan boys out there that

want to fucking lynch me right now.

:

00:52:39,978 --> 00:52:42,558

We're going to get off John Wick

hatred and we're getting into

:

00:52:42,558 --> 00:52:43,738

something that's kind of cool.

:

00:52:44,748 --> 00:52:46,268

It's called praise of the killer.

:

00:52:46,768 --> 00:52:50,668

Robert McKee coined the term.

:

00:52:51,288 --> 00:52:52,498

Although I'm going to be honest.

:

00:52:52,538 --> 00:52:56,148

I didn't know the term praise of the

killer until I heard here's my shout out.

:

00:52:57,018 --> 00:53:00,348

I didn't hear it until Jimmy

George used it on his bright

:

00:53:00,388 --> 00:53:02,088

writer's blockbusters podcast.

:

00:53:02,098 --> 00:53:02,328

Chris: Yeah.

:

00:53:02,338 --> 00:53:03,618

I think I, I think I listened to that one.

:

00:53:03,618 --> 00:53:04,668

Cause I remember they use it.

:

00:53:04,708 --> 00:53:05,878

Jerome: They use it all the time.

:

00:53:05,938 --> 00:53:06,288

Chris: Yeah.

:

00:53:07,068 --> 00:53:10,128

Jerome: It's when others

speak of the villain and tell

:

00:53:10,128 --> 00:53:11,558

you all about their power.

:

00:53:12,558 --> 00:53:15,588

And to let the audience know

how really deadly the guy is.

:

00:53:16,028 --> 00:53:20,428

Common examples to mention since,

you know, since we're, we're

:

00:53:20,428 --> 00:53:22,488

going to talk about it, we might

talk about it in the future.

:

00:53:22,678 --> 00:53:23,898

Let me just get this out.

:

00:53:24,398 --> 00:53:27,448

Here's three perfect examples

of praise of the killer.

:

00:53:28,233 --> 00:53:30,433

Quince Indianapolis speech in Jaws.

:

00:53:30,443 --> 00:53:30,803

Yeah.

:

00:53:30,823 --> 00:53:35,663

Specifically when he says, and this

is a quote, sometimes that shark looks

:

00:53:35,663 --> 00:53:37,493

right at you, right in your eyes.

:

00:53:37,523 --> 00:53:41,303

The thing about a shark is

he's got lifeless eyes, black

:

00:53:41,303 --> 00:53:42,473

eyes, like a doll's eyes.

:

00:53:43,313 --> 00:53:47,373

When he comes at you, he doesn't

seem to be living till he bites you.

:

00:53:47,443 --> 00:53:50,133

And those black eyes roll over white.

:

00:53:50,173 --> 00:53:56,293

And then uh, then you hear that terrible

high pitch screaming, the ocean turns red.

:

00:53:56,658 --> 00:53:59,928

And despite all your pounding

and hollering, those sharks come

:

00:53:59,928 --> 00:54:01,888

in and they rip you to pieces.

:

00:54:02,568 --> 00:54:03,028

End quote.

:

00:54:04,468 --> 00:54:05,248

Here's another one.

:

00:54:05,338 --> 00:54:07,658

Ash hyping the xenomorph and alien.

:

00:54:07,678 --> 00:54:08,268

The first one.

:

00:54:08,298 --> 00:54:09,118

Oh yeah.

:

00:54:09,178 --> 00:54:09,488

Yep.

:

00:54:09,528 --> 00:54:12,078

You still don't understand what

you're dealing with, do you?

:

00:54:12,418 --> 00:54:13,778

A perfect organism.

:

00:54:14,028 --> 00:54:17,448

Its structural perfection is

matched only by its hostility.

:

00:54:17,808 --> 00:54:19,458

I admire its purity.

:

00:54:19,728 --> 00:54:20,688

A survivor.

:

00:54:20,938 --> 00:54:22,608

Unclouded by conscience.

:

00:54:22,848 --> 00:54:25,008

Remorse or delusions of morality.

:

00:54:25,008 --> 00:54:25,318

Yeah.

:

00:54:25,468 --> 00:54:29,418

I can't lie to you about your

chances, but you have my sympathies.

:

00:54:29,428 --> 00:54:30,918

Chris: How about the Terminator?

:

00:54:31,088 --> 00:54:32,428

Jerome: I was just, Oh my God.

:

00:54:32,808 --> 00:54:34,138

It's like you're in my brain.

:

00:54:34,148 --> 00:54:34,488

Chris: Yeah.

:

00:54:34,488 --> 00:54:37,168

My mind went to what's his name?

:

00:54:37,168 --> 00:54:37,378

Reese.

:

00:54:37,868 --> 00:54:40,678

Jerome: So I was, the third one

is Kyle Reese and the Terminator.

:

00:54:40,898 --> 00:54:46,728

Listen, and understand, that Terminator

is out there, it can't be bargained

:

00:54:46,728 --> 00:54:51,558

with, it can't be reasoned with,

it doesn't feel pity, or remorse,

:

00:54:51,808 --> 00:54:57,798

or fear, and it absolutely will

not stop, ever, until you are dead.

:

00:54:59,098 --> 00:54:59,408

Dude.

:

00:55:00,738 --> 00:55:04,918

So, that's, so for you beginning

writers out there, that's

:

00:55:04,918 --> 00:55:06,058

the praise of the killer.

:

00:55:06,208 --> 00:55:08,718

Now, mostly it serves for the bad guy.

:

00:55:09,053 --> 00:55:14,973

But in these two movies, Unforgiven and

John Wick, they are loaded with praise

:

00:55:14,973 --> 00:55:17,043

of the killer for the protagonist.

:

00:55:17,043 --> 00:55:17,753

Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

:

00:55:17,823 --> 00:55:18,283

Jerome: Right?

:

00:55:18,383 --> 00:55:23,313

Others speak about them with stories

that would make you fear them.

:

00:55:23,313 --> 00:55:27,783

In Unforgiven, several stories about

Will's past come up throughout the movie.

:

00:55:28,003 --> 00:55:32,198

We already talked about, you know,

the myth versus reality in this case.

:

00:55:32,198 --> 00:55:34,348

Reality was worse than the story.

:

00:55:34,488 --> 00:55:38,988

Specifically, at the end, after the

audience has already heard all these

:

00:55:38,988 --> 00:55:43,898

stories to build up William Money, here

comes Little Sue on a horse, right?

:

00:55:43,898 --> 00:55:47,738

Delivering the money, and she tells

him how Little Bill beat Ned to

:

00:55:47,738 --> 00:55:52,138

death, and in his dying moments, he

told who William Money really was.

:

00:55:52,338 --> 00:55:53,138

This is a quote.

:

00:55:53,993 --> 00:55:57,613

He said how you was really

William Money out of Missouri.

:

00:55:57,883 --> 00:56:01,973

Little Bill said the same William Money

that dynamited the Rock Island and Pacific

:

00:56:01,973 --> 00:56:04,713

in 69, killing women and children and all.

:

00:56:04,983 --> 00:56:07,183

And Ned said you'd done

a lot worse than that.

:

00:56:07,423 --> 00:56:11,223

Said you was more cold blooded than

William Bonney, and how if you hurt

:

00:56:11,223 --> 00:56:14,488

Ned again, You were going to come

back and kill him like you killed a U.

:

00:56:14,488 --> 00:56:14,648

S.

:

00:56:14,658 --> 00:56:15,798

Marshal in 70.

:

00:56:16,768 --> 00:56:17,348

End quote.

:

00:56:17,768 --> 00:56:23,218

At this point, even the Schofield kid

gives this astonished look at Will, like,

:

00:56:23,548 --> 00:56:25,488

Fuck, I haven't even heard those stories!

:

00:56:25,828 --> 00:56:31,933

Like, like, it turns he's way too Way

more deadlier than his reputation gives.

:

00:56:32,083 --> 00:56:34,273

And John Wick Alio knows him.

:

00:56:34,533 --> 00:56:35,613

Vigo knows him.

:

00:56:35,733 --> 00:56:35,823

Yeah.

:

00:56:35,853 --> 00:56:36,603

Everyone.

:

00:56:36,603 --> 00:56:38,703

But the son seems to know him, right?

:

00:56:38,703 --> 00:56:42,393

At one point, Vigo is trying to explain

this to ISF, he says, and this is a

:

00:56:42,393 --> 00:56:45,443

quote, he once was an associate of ours.

:

00:56:45,623 --> 00:56:47,573

We called him Baba Jaga.

:

00:56:47,873 --> 00:56:52,193

The boogeyman, the boogeyman . Well,

John wasn't exactly the boogeyman.

:

00:56:52,598 --> 00:56:55,378

He was the one you sent to

kill the fucking boogeyman.

:

00:56:56,258 --> 00:56:59,998

John is a man of focus,

commitment, sheer will.

:

00:57:00,198 --> 00:57:03,408

I once saw him kill three

men in a bar with a pencil.

:

00:57:03,658 --> 00:57:05,428

A fucking pencil.

:

00:57:06,068 --> 00:57:06,658

End quote.

:

00:57:07,258 --> 00:57:10,408

Like, so, you know, if these

two are not praising the killer

:

00:57:10,408 --> 00:57:11,808

speeches, I don't know what is.

:

00:57:11,848 --> 00:57:12,248

Right.

:

00:57:12,248 --> 00:57:12,468

Right?

:

00:57:13,238 --> 00:57:18,678

So, for you beginning writers out there,

again, if you're writing a villain or a

:

00:57:18,678 --> 00:57:22,918

horror film, The examples of Jaws, Alien,

and The Terminator are perfect examples.

:

00:57:23,088 --> 00:57:25,928

But even if you're writing one

about the protagonist being a

:

00:57:25,928 --> 00:57:29,848

badass, you can add a praise to the

killer's speech about your badass.

:

00:57:29,888 --> 00:57:30,408

Chris: Oh yeah.

:

00:57:31,843 --> 00:57:32,433

All right.

:

00:57:32,443 --> 00:57:32,813

Great.

:

00:57:32,973 --> 00:57:33,533

I loved it.

:

00:57:34,003 --> 00:57:34,623

Jerome: Trivia.

:

00:57:34,903 --> 00:57:39,083

The filmmakers originally wanted

to have Perkins nose broken after

:

00:57:39,083 --> 00:57:43,193

her fight with John, but the

studio said it was going too far.

:

00:57:43,543 --> 00:57:48,163

Producer, producer, David Lee said,

quote, they were like, you have two women

:

00:57:48,163 --> 00:57:49,518

in this movie and one of them is dead.

:

00:57:49,858 --> 00:57:51,578

You really want to break

the other one's nose?

:

00:57:54,768 --> 00:57:55,308

Chris: That's funny.

:

00:57:56,678 --> 00:58:00,378

Jerome: The filmmakers acknowledge that

in the real world, here's the part of

:

00:58:00,378 --> 00:58:03,588

one of my plot point arguments, the

filmmakers acknowledge that in the

:

00:58:03,588 --> 00:58:08,923

real world, a retired assassin Probably

would have changed his name But they

:

00:58:09,033 --> 00:58:12,753

they liked the idea of this world

being similar to that of a comic book

:

00:58:13,023 --> 00:58:13,263

Chris: Yeah,

:

00:58:13,283 --> 00:58:16,523

Jerome: you know, so at least

they were aware of the glaring

:

00:58:16,523 --> 00:58:18,073

plot hole that I ranted about.

:

00:58:18,123 --> 00:58:21,183

Chris: Yeah They went out

this went all in on it.

:

00:58:22,073 --> 00:58:25,093

Jerome: All right last trivia point

screenwriter derrick coles they

:

00:58:25,093 --> 00:58:29,893

completed his first draft of the

script in just one month Now I want

:

00:58:29,893 --> 00:58:34,698

to caution writers With trivia like

this, we've heard the same fantastic

:

00:58:34,698 --> 00:58:36,848

story about Stallone writing Rocky.

:

00:58:37,078 --> 00:58:40,238

Oh, he woke up in the middle of the

night and he wrote Rocky in three hours.

:

00:58:40,318 --> 00:58:42,438

Look, look, these are stories.

:

00:58:42,518 --> 00:58:42,918

Okay.

:

00:58:43,138 --> 00:58:46,908

And they're just as exaggerated

as our myth versus reality that we

:

00:58:46,908 --> 00:58:48,268

talked about in both of these movies.

:

00:58:49,398 --> 00:58:50,818

Right now.

:

00:58:51,738 --> 00:58:52,148

Okay.

:

00:58:52,148 --> 00:58:54,358

It might be trivia that

that was his first draft.

:

00:58:54,928 --> 00:58:58,588

The movie you see in theaters,

Stallone even said this, right?

:

00:58:58,678 --> 00:59:03,708

Well, wait, before we get to Stallone,

the movie that Derek Colstead

:

00:59:03,718 --> 00:59:07,368

wrote, John Wick, I guarantee you,

it went through several rewrites

:

00:59:07,628 --> 00:59:08,908

before it ever hit theaters.

:

00:59:09,298 --> 00:59:13,988

And as far as the Rocky story goes,

Stallone said he wrote a draft in three

:

00:59:13,988 --> 00:59:17,008

days, which in and of itself is amazing.

:

00:59:17,008 --> 00:59:17,688

I'll give him that.

:

00:59:17,728 --> 00:59:23,363

But he even said 90 percent of that draft

he wrote Never made it into the film.

:

00:59:23,423 --> 00:59:23,903

Wow.

:

00:59:24,353 --> 00:59:28,883

So that shows how much rewriting and

rewriting and rewriting goes into pre

:

00:59:28,883 --> 00:59:32,953

production production and even in the

editing room, the writing never stops.

:

00:59:32,953 --> 00:59:34,553

The process never stops.

:

00:59:35,023 --> 00:59:36,723

So that's a reality check for you.

:

00:59:36,723 --> 00:59:37,713

Beginning writers.

:

00:59:37,753 --> 00:59:40,503

Don't think you're going to

pen Casablanca in a week.

:

00:59:40,513 --> 00:59:42,223

It's not going to happen, right?

:

00:59:42,553 --> 00:59:44,843

Just accept that there's,

it's a collaborative art.

:

00:59:45,378 --> 00:59:49,868

The editors, the writers, the actors,

the directors, EVERYBODY else is gonna

:

00:59:49,898 --> 00:59:53,428

have a piece of your screenplay and

are gonna make it into something.

:

00:59:54,248 --> 00:59:55,898

You didn't want, right?

:

00:59:56,118 --> 00:59:57,308

But they might make it better.

:

00:59:57,368 --> 00:59:58,308

They might make it worse.

:

00:59:58,708 --> 01:00:00,658

Gremlins is a perfect example.

:

01:00:00,898 --> 01:00:04,468

If you read the original screenplay

for gremlins, it's a lot different for

:

01:00:04,468 --> 01:00:06,398

the movie and the movie is way better.

:

01:00:07,648 --> 01:00:07,958

All right.

:

01:00:07,958 --> 01:00:09,508

What do you got before

we get to six degrees?

:

01:00:10,248 --> 01:00:10,958

Chris: Oh, not much.

:

01:00:11,018 --> 01:00:15,498

I just remember one of the things

my, my son pointed out, was it when

:

01:00:15,498 --> 01:00:18,188

miss Perkins was killed Yeah, I

didn't even mention that actually.

:

01:00:18,188 --> 01:00:22,808

Was it, was the scene where she

was killed where he puts a pillow

:

01:00:22,808 --> 01:00:24,258

over and shoots into the pillow?

:

01:00:24,738 --> 01:00:28,648

Jerome: No, she, no, she kills,

she kills the guy, the guy

:

01:00:28,648 --> 01:00:29,758

that's keeping her captive.

:

01:00:29,768 --> 01:00:31,978

She escapes, shoots

him through the pillow.

:

01:00:32,198 --> 01:00:32,618

Chris: Yeah.

:

01:00:32,953 --> 01:00:36,413

Well, the funny thing about that, my son

pointed out, he's like, yeah, that, that

:

01:00:36,413 --> 01:00:39,913

doesn't muffle the sound when you just

put the barrel of the gun on a pillow,

:

01:00:42,383 --> 01:00:43,223

which it did.

:

01:00:43,273 --> 01:00:46,473

Jerome: Yeah, it's great to have

real gunsmiths watching movies.

:

01:00:46,473 --> 01:00:47,853

Chris: Well, I mean, it makes sense.

:

01:00:47,863 --> 01:00:50,853

The explosion happens back in

the chamber, not down at the

:

01:00:50,853 --> 01:00:52,013

end of the barrel, you know?

:

01:00:52,173 --> 01:00:52,463

Jerome: Right.

:

01:00:52,483 --> 01:00:53,493

But they do that all the time.

:

01:00:53,493 --> 01:00:56,303

You see that in so many movies

where they put a pillow over

:

01:00:56,303 --> 01:00:57,683

somebody and then, and then shoot.

:

01:00:57,843 --> 01:00:58,093

Chris: Yeah.

:

01:00:58,113 --> 01:01:01,163

Jerome: But what was interesting, I didn't

even mention how Perkins gets killed.

:

01:01:01,223 --> 01:01:04,733

She tries to leave the hotel one

night and Winston shows up in

:

01:01:04,733 --> 01:01:06,313

McShane with all his hence men.

:

01:01:06,313 --> 01:01:11,293

And he says, you broke rule number one,

you conducted business at the hotel.

:

01:01:11,593 --> 01:01:13,533

Your privileges here have been revoked.

:

01:01:13,863 --> 01:01:19,228

And he walks away and Six dudes lay

lead into her to start shooting her.

:

01:01:19,288 --> 01:01:20,708

Chris: Yeah, I forgot that's how she died.

:

01:01:21,068 --> 01:01:22,648

Jerome: In execution style.

:

01:01:23,208 --> 01:01:23,528

Yeah.

:

01:01:24,298 --> 01:01:28,008

So Ian McShane has like two scenes in

the whole movie and they're both great.

:

01:01:28,128 --> 01:01:29,318

They're both awesome.

:

01:01:29,828 --> 01:01:34,068

So again, like I want to reiterate,

despite all my plot holes that I

:

01:01:34,068 --> 01:01:36,488

was mad about, it is a fun movie.

:

01:01:36,488 --> 01:01:37,848

John Wick's a fun movie.

:

01:01:37,908 --> 01:01:43,098

And what makes it fun, not only is

Keanu Reeves, And, and the acting and

:

01:01:43,098 --> 01:01:44,778

the action sequences are really cool.

:

01:01:44,778 --> 01:01:46,708

The fight scenes are so cool.

:

01:01:47,218 --> 01:01:50,048

It's, it's got great lines of dialogue.

:

01:01:50,638 --> 01:01:53,188

You know, I love listening

to these people talk.

:

01:01:53,833 --> 01:01:55,233

You know, It's a fun movie.

:

01:01:55,233 --> 01:01:56,653

It's to me, it's not

as good as unforgiven.

:

01:01:56,653 --> 01:01:57,083

I'm forgiven.

:

01:01:57,553 --> 01:02:00,953

I think is one of the greatest

Westerns of all time, if not the

:

01:02:00,973 --> 01:02:05,763

greatest, it's in the top three and

it's in probably, what did I say?

:

01:02:05,763 --> 01:02:07,463

I text you, I text you at one point.

:

01:02:07,983 --> 01:02:08,613

Is it top?

:

01:02:08,623 --> 01:02:10,833

Did I say it was top

three films of the 90s?

:

01:02:12,263 --> 01:02:12,823

It might be.

:

01:02:13,083 --> 01:02:17,263

I gotta say Schindler's List

and Silence of the Lambs.

:

01:02:18,703 --> 01:02:20,753

Schindler's List, Silence

of the Lambs and Unforgiven.

:

01:02:20,763 --> 01:02:22,773

That might be your top three in any order.

:

01:02:22,773 --> 01:02:24,063

I don't know what order you put them in.

:

01:02:24,623 --> 01:02:27,693

But Unforgiven, Schindler's

List, and Sound Slams might be

:

01:02:27,693 --> 01:02:29,653

the top three movies of the 90s.

:

01:02:29,853 --> 01:02:30,903

And here's the funny part.

:

01:02:31,353 --> 01:02:32,833

They came out in three straight years.

:

01:02:32,863 --> 01:02:33,243

Chris: Hmm.

:

01:02:33,323 --> 01:02:35,623

Jerome: 91, 92, and 93.

:

01:02:36,423 --> 01:02:41,093

And although the 90s are filled with

great movies, it was top heavy, man,

:

01:02:41,093 --> 01:02:42,723

right when we get into the year.

:

01:02:42,953 --> 01:02:45,193

And Goodfellas is:

:

01:02:45,273 --> 01:02:45,533

Chris: Yeah.

:

01:02:45,963 --> 01:02:51,948

Jerome: So, I mean, Unforgiven to me is

one of the top three movies of the decade.

:

01:02:52,108 --> 01:02:52,638

I gotta get on.

:

01:02:52,818 --> 01:02:54,318

I gotta get Goodfellas in there.

:

01:02:54,348 --> 01:02:54,728

My bad.

:

01:02:54,768 --> 01:02:55,118

Okay.

:

01:02:55,318 --> 01:02:55,738

Top four.

:

01:02:55,738 --> 01:02:56,398

It's top four.

:

01:02:56,458 --> 01:02:57,708

Yeah, it's top four.

:

01:02:57,738 --> 01:02:59,838

Goodfellas is in there

somewhere, but it's top four.

:

01:03:01,348 --> 01:03:01,638

All right.

:

01:03:01,648 --> 01:03:03,108

So six degrees,

:

01:03:03,178 --> 01:03:04,168

Chris: six degrees.

:

01:03:05,418 --> 01:03:11,018

Jerome: All right, Six Degrees, why don't

you tell me who you tasked me to combine?

:

01:03:11,028 --> 01:03:14,538

Chris: Yeah, you know, I always try to

make it difficult and when we do Six

:

01:03:14,538 --> 01:03:20,008

Degrees, the, the goal is to see if we can

figure out if there's two actors that we

:

01:03:20,008 --> 01:03:22,598

cannot connect within Six Degrees, right?

:

01:03:23,058 --> 01:03:26,878

And the added difficulty with

our game is you cannot use the

:

01:03:26,878 --> 01:03:29,128

movies that we are talking about.

:

01:03:30,258 --> 01:03:34,068

So, I chose what's, what, how

do you pronounce your name?

:

01:03:34,068 --> 01:03:37,328

Aileen Lezavour?

:

01:03:37,328 --> 01:03:37,748

Yeah, Aileen

:

01:03:37,748 --> 01:03:38,118

Jerome: maybe?

:

01:03:38,118 --> 01:03:39,048

Aileen Levasseur?

:

01:03:39,048 --> 01:03:40,758

Levasseur,

:

01:03:40,778 --> 01:03:41,938

Chris: that's Penny Money.

:

01:03:42,188 --> 01:03:44,868

That's the little girl,

Penny Money in Unforgiven.

:

01:03:44,898 --> 01:03:47,008

Jerome: Yeah, she plays

William Money's daughter.

:

01:03:47,038 --> 01:03:49,048

Chris: Yep, and Bridget Regan?

:

01:03:49,108 --> 01:03:49,698

Or Regan?

:

01:03:50,033 --> 01:03:51,983

Who plays Addie the bartender, right?

:

01:03:52,263 --> 01:03:53,963

Jerome: And the bartender

at the Continental.

:

01:03:54,083 --> 01:03:54,363

Yeah.

:

01:03:54,403 --> 01:03:54,843

All right.

:

01:03:54,853 --> 01:04:00,183

So this was actually easier than you

thought, but it took a lot of research.

:

01:04:02,073 --> 01:04:03,963

So for those of you that are

like, well, that's cheating.

:

01:04:03,963 --> 01:04:05,073

He used IMDB.

:

01:04:05,083 --> 01:04:06,873

This isn't a stump Jerome game.

:

01:04:07,253 --> 01:04:12,043

We're actually trying to see if

two people can not be connected.

:

01:04:12,073 --> 01:04:12,323

Right.

:

01:04:12,383 --> 01:04:15,843

And we have yet to find where

two people cannot be connected.

:

01:04:15,863 --> 01:04:21,123

So, um, Aline Levasseur

only was in three movies.

:

01:04:21,503 --> 01:04:22,803

Unforgiven was one of them.

:

01:04:23,043 --> 01:04:26,503

ther one was Bye Bye Blues in:

:

01:04:27,493 --> 01:04:31,963

In that film she was with Luke Reilly,

who played a character named Max Gramley.

:

01:04:32,203 --> 01:04:36,178

He was in Private Parts in

:

:

01:04:37,618 --> 01:04:38,708

Howard Stern movie.

:

01:04:38,718 --> 01:04:39,088

Yeah.

:

01:04:39,428 --> 01:04:45,138

In that movie also was Adam

Lefevre, who played sales manager.

:

01:04:45,368 --> 01:04:46,028

You know him.

:

01:04:46,028 --> 01:04:48,668

If you looked him up on NDB, he's

one of those guys who, you know, his

:

01:04:48,668 --> 01:04:49,978

face has been in a million movies.

:

01:04:50,368 --> 01:04:54,528

He was in the babysitters:

:

01:04:54,538 --> 01:04:57,218

Brown with Bridget Regan.

:

01:04:57,248 --> 01:04:57,768

Chris: Stop.

:

01:04:57,788 --> 01:04:58,108

So?

:

01:04:58,128 --> 01:04:59,208

Was that three?

:

01:04:59,208 --> 01:04:59,218

Jerome: Three.

:

01:04:59,218 --> 01:04:59,498

Stop.

:

01:04:59,788 --> 01:05:00,118

Three.

:

01:05:00,528 --> 01:05:00,808

Man.

:

01:05:00,808 --> 01:05:01,268

Three.

:

01:05:01,503 --> 01:05:03,873

Bye Bye Blues, Private

Parts, and The Baby Sitters.

:

01:05:03,883 --> 01:05:04,453

You know,

:

01:05:04,473 --> 01:05:07,443

Chris: some of these kids, they only

were in a few movies, but sometimes they

:

01:05:07,443 --> 01:05:09,263

got big names in those movies, you know?

:

01:05:09,363 --> 01:05:10,123

Jerome: Yes, they do.

:

01:05:10,353 --> 01:05:11,483

And we didn't even use Unforgiven!

:

01:05:12,063 --> 01:05:12,503

Chris: I know.

:

01:05:12,713 --> 01:05:13,163

Yeah.

:

01:05:13,803 --> 01:05:14,383

Good job.

:

01:05:15,633 --> 01:05:16,693

Well, this was fun, man.

:

01:05:17,093 --> 01:05:19,253

I uh, totally enjoyed this.

:

01:05:19,423 --> 01:05:20,333

Jerome: I love this one.

:

01:05:20,383 --> 01:05:23,633

I love them all, but sometimes

I get really geeked about

:

01:05:23,733 --> 01:05:25,333

movies that I learn a lot about.

:

01:05:25,713 --> 01:05:25,983

Right.

:

01:05:26,013 --> 01:05:30,368

And as much as I love Unforgiven, Man,

I really learned a lot when I really

:

01:05:30,378 --> 01:05:33,058

dug deep into the, into the breakdown.

:

01:05:33,538 --> 01:05:38,518

And I realized that William Money's

real sacrifice was, was Ned dying.

:

01:05:38,938 --> 01:05:41,668

Like that, that was his

payment for his past sins.

:

01:05:41,848 --> 01:05:43,648

Like, I never thought of that before.

:

01:05:43,678 --> 01:05:44,028

Yeah.

:

01:05:44,078 --> 01:05:44,898

You know what I mean?

:

01:05:45,278 --> 01:05:48,538

But I was like, damn, that makes so

much sense when he's, when he feels

:

01:05:48,638 --> 01:05:50,108

like he's dying from the fever.

:

01:05:50,198 --> 01:05:50,688

Chris: Right.

:

01:05:51,198 --> 01:05:53,068

Jerome: And he's like, I

see the angel of death.

:

01:05:53,098 --> 01:05:56,523

It didn't occur to me that it

was like, Oh, no, your sins

:

01:05:56,523 --> 01:05:57,713

are you're going to lose Ned.

:

01:05:58,193 --> 01:05:59,033

You know what I mean?

:

01:05:59,033 --> 01:05:59,773

Like, yeah.

:

01:05:59,833 --> 01:06:02,893

And then uh, with John Wick,

I mean, it was my first time

:

01:06:02,893 --> 01:06:04,253

seeing it just three weeks ago.

:

01:06:04,253 --> 01:06:08,113

So yeah, man, I love, I love this kind

of discovery with movies like this.

:

01:06:08,173 --> 01:06:09,433

Chris: Yeah, absolutely.

:

01:06:10,883 --> 01:06:11,473

Jerome: anything else?

:

01:06:11,523 --> 01:06:14,773

Chris: Yeah, I just want to say if

you would like to reach out to us,

:

01:06:14,783 --> 01:06:17,443

you can do it through our social

media channels if you'd like.

:

01:06:17,493 --> 01:06:21,233

Facebook, Instagram X, we're there too.

:

01:06:21,613 --> 01:06:23,003

You can also email us at

:

01:06:23,003 --> 01:06:25,073

silverscreenhappyhour@gmail.com.

:

01:06:25,073 --> 01:06:27,143

Right.

:

01:06:28,403 --> 01:06:31,813

Jerome: So, so the shout outs, I know

you gave a shout on the last episode.

:

01:06:31,813 --> 01:06:34,963

I shouted out as well, my neighbor,

but the other shot that I was talking

:

01:06:34,963 --> 01:06:39,103

about, I did mention the Writer's

Blockbusters podcast for you writers.

:

01:06:39,513 --> 01:06:42,763

I cannot tell you what a fountain

of information that podcast is.

:

01:06:43,093 --> 01:06:47,423

It's you know, Jamie Nash,

Bob Rose and Jimmy George.

:

01:06:47,423 --> 01:06:47,683

so much.

:

01:06:47,903 --> 01:06:50,883

And Jimmy, I name dropped

about the praise of the killer.

:

01:06:50,963 --> 01:06:55,753

I actually we, we occasionally trade

emails every now and again, or Instagram

:

01:06:55,753 --> 01:06:58,533

messages about movies and stuff.

:

01:06:58,533 --> 01:07:00,263

And we'll talk about

the podcast and stuff.

:

01:07:00,263 --> 01:07:03,703

And I actually asked him, I was like, man,

you talk about praise of the killer a lot.

:

01:07:03,743 --> 01:07:06,723

And I realized it was Robert McKee

who actually coined that term.

:

01:07:07,248 --> 01:07:09,708

But like I said, Jimmy

talks about it a lot.

:

01:07:09,708 --> 01:07:13,818

So I, I actually think it's a Jimmy

term more than a Robert McKee term

:

01:07:14,138 --> 01:07:15,928

just cause he loves to talk about it.

:

01:07:15,988 --> 01:07:17,428

so thank you, Jimmy.

:

01:07:17,428 --> 01:07:20,968

And uh, the Writers Blockbusters

gang for your fountain of

:

01:07:20,968 --> 01:07:22,028

knowledge and screenwriting.

:

01:07:22,028 --> 01:07:25,548

And again, beginning writers, if

we scratch the surface, you'll get

:

01:07:25,548 --> 01:07:27,228

a lot more crap from those guys.

:

01:07:27,228 --> 01:07:29,088

We don't really dig into craft that much.

:

01:07:29,088 --> 01:07:31,598

We Snyder's beat sheet.

:

01:07:32,128 --> 01:07:34,268

That's the main crux of our show.

:

01:07:34,358 --> 01:07:34,628

Yeah.

:

01:07:34,668 --> 01:07:37,508

Just, just, just so how

most films can fit into

:

01:07:37,508 --> 01:07:39,218

the Blake Snyder beat sheet

:

01:07:39,218 --> 01:07:41,588

Jerome: and hit those points

and they hit them in order.

:

01:07:42,038 --> 01:07:42,438

But yeah,

:

01:07:44,323 --> 01:07:45,683

Chris: Oh, I got one more shout out.

:

01:07:45,983 --> 01:07:50,373

This has nothing to do with our

podcast or movies, but I guess I

:

01:07:50,383 --> 01:07:55,003

could say that the director of this

music video does have an IMDB page.

:

01:07:55,303 --> 01:07:59,193

But the some friends of ours are

in a band called the Native Howl..

:

01:07:59,858 --> 01:08:05,988

And they, they, they kind of coined

this term thrash grass to describe

:

01:08:05,988 --> 01:08:10,158

their music because they combine

bluegrass with thrash metal.

:

01:08:10,698 --> 01:08:14,318

And if you know bluegrass, it's

a high tempo type of music and

:

01:08:14,318 --> 01:08:19,048

so is thrash metal and it works

beautifully with the banjo and the

:

01:08:19,058 --> 01:08:21,158

speed and acoustic guitars and stuff.

:

01:08:21,518 --> 01:08:23,877

Well, they just did a Johnny Cash cover.

:

01:08:24,468 --> 01:08:26,997

That's, I think it's a

freaking masterpiece.

:

01:08:27,087 --> 01:08:31,455

So if you guys Would like to go

check this out uh, the Native Howl.,

:

01:08:31,473 --> 01:08:32,801

God's gonna to cut you

:

01:08:32,801 --> 01:08:33,362

Chris: down.

:

01:08:33,892 --> 01:08:37,692

It's a Johnny Cash cover and they

just knocked it out of the park.

:

01:08:37,892 --> 01:08:41,412

I've been playing the song on a loop

because the song alone is worth,

:

01:08:41,532 --> 01:08:44,971

you know, just putting it on a

loop and listen to over and over.

:

01:08:45,242 --> 01:08:46,457

But the video is a fire.

:

01:08:47,527 --> 01:08:48,567

They did a great job.

:

01:08:48,567 --> 01:08:49,727

So hats off to the

:

01:08:49,727 --> 01:08:51,434

guys at the Native Howl.

:

01:08:51,434 --> 01:08:52,117

And you

:

01:08:52,117 --> 01:08:55,657

Jerome: know what, speaking of that,

and not, this is not that this is any

:

01:08:55,657 --> 01:09:00,017

sort of a shout out, but because you,

you got me thinking about you know,

:

01:09:00,047 --> 01:09:04,737

upcoming movies, Timothee Chalamet, who

we know from the Dune movies, right?

:

01:09:04,737 --> 01:09:06,636

We did it, we, we did a Dune episode.

:

01:09:07,221 --> 01:09:09,971

He is portraying Bob Dylan.

:

01:09:10,282 --> 01:09:11,466

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

:

01:09:11,466 --> 01:09:15,532

In a movie that's supposed to come out

this year called, A Complete Unknown.

:

01:09:15,542 --> 01:09:16,801

Chris: Yeah, I'm looking forward to that.

:

01:09:16,812 --> 01:09:20,732

Jerome: And, dude, I am

so, I saw a trailer for it.

:

01:09:20,732 --> 01:09:20,942

Yeah.

:

01:09:21,202 --> 01:09:23,872

And I'm so fucking I

think I sent it to you.

:

01:09:23,872 --> 01:09:27,362

You might have, and in fact uh, uh,

the reason I missed it, because you

:

01:09:27,502 --> 01:09:31,982

reminded me, Boyd Holbrook, an actor,

he's playing Johnny Cash in the movie.

:

01:09:32,372 --> 01:09:35,062

So when you said Johnny

Cash it reminded me of that.

:

01:09:35,312 --> 01:09:41,051

I'm just pumped man because I love

that guy Timothy Chalamet and of course

:

01:09:41,242 --> 01:09:46,782

one of my favorite if not me number

one favorite singer songwriter of all

:

01:09:46,782 --> 01:09:52,897

time is Bob Dylan, and I've heard,

I don't know if it's true, but I've

:

01:09:52,897 --> 01:09:56,837

heard that Timothee Chalamet is going

to do his own singing in the movie.

:

01:09:56,947 --> 01:09:57,977

I think I heard that too,

:

01:09:58,057 --> 01:09:59,543

Chris: so yeah, it should be interesting.

:

01:09:59,543 --> 01:10:02,007

Jerome: And didn't Joaquin

Phoenix do that in Walk the Line?

:

01:10:02,397 --> 01:10:03,857

Didn't he sing Johnny Cash's songs?

:

01:10:03,857 --> 01:10:04,267

He did,

:

01:10:04,267 --> 01:10:05,597

Chris: yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, he did.

:

01:10:05,607 --> 01:10:06,607

Yeah, I mean that too.

:

01:10:06,637 --> 01:10:07,807

And he did a good job, yeah.

:

01:10:08,772 --> 01:10:09,202

Jerome: Yeah.

:

01:10:09,242 --> 01:10:11,172

So I just see on IMDb.

:

01:10:11,172 --> 01:10:14,482

It's actually set to be released

on Christmas day of this year.

:

01:10:14,522 --> 01:10:15,072

Chris: Really?

:

01:10:15,102 --> 01:10:15,482

Okay.

:

01:10:15,502 --> 01:10:15,942

Yeah.

:

01:10:15,942 --> 01:10:17,192

I know what I'm doing that weekend.

:

01:10:17,192 --> 01:10:17,542

Jerome: Yeah.

:

01:10:17,592 --> 01:10:19,462

I know what I'm doing Christmas day.

:

01:10:23,192 --> 01:10:23,992

All right.

:

01:10:24,132 --> 01:10:24,752

Wrap it up.

:

01:10:24,752 --> 01:10:26,072

Let's land this plane.

:

01:10:26,202 --> 01:10:26,632

Chris: All right.

:

01:10:26,632 --> 01:10:29,702

Well, you know what we say at the

end of each of these episodes,

:

01:10:29,712 --> 01:10:31,852

go support your vocal cinemas,

:

01:10:32,662 --> 01:10:33,792

Jerome: keep drinking and keep watching.

:

01:10:36,592 --> 01:10:38,956

Click, click, click, click, click, click.

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About the Podcast

Show artwork for Silver Screen Happy Hour
Silver Screen Happy Hour
With the Wiegand Brothers

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About your hosts

Profile picture for Jerome Wiegand

Jerome Wiegand

Born and raised in Metro Detroit, Michigan. Graduate of Columbia College Chicago with a degree in Film/Screenwriting. Have lived in California since 2001. I enjoy screenwriting, script consulting and film analysis.
Profile picture for Chris Wiegand

Chris Wiegand