Episode 1
Ethan Hawke Day: Dead Poets Society (1989) & Training Day (2001)
What do these two movies have in common? Where are they different? Join us for a drink and discussion about DEAD POETS SOCIETY (1989) and TRAINING DAY (2001).
In honor of the expensive whiskey that Denzel's character drinks in a scene in Training Day, Jerome enjoys some Johnny Walker Blue. Chris went with a nice stout from New Holland Brewing called THE POET as a hat tip to DPS.
In the first part of the podcast, the hosts engage in a thorough analysis of the film "Training Day." They begin by providing background information on the movie's director, Antoine Fuqua, and its main actors, Denzel Washington, and Ethan Hawke. The hosts delve into the gritty and intense atmosphere of the story, set in the morally ambiguous world of law enforcement. They discuss the characters of Alonzo Harris and Jake Hoyt, highlighting the complex dynamic between the seasoned, corrupt detective and the idealistic rookie cop. The hosts examine the film's exploration of themes such as power, corruption, and loyalty, as well as its depiction of the dark underbelly of the Los Angeles Police Department. They praise Denzel Washington's exceptional performance, which earned him an Academy Award, and commend the film for its captivating storytelling and gripping action sequences...In spite of the studio snubbing Ethan Hawke AS THE LEAD!
In the second part of this episode, they introduce the film "Dead Poets Society" and set the stage by describing the setting of Welton Academy, a prestigious college preparatory school. They highlight the clash between traditional values and the unconventional ideologies of John Keating, the English professor portrayed by Robin Williams. The hosts analyze the opening scene and discuss the school's motto and the expectations placed on the protagonist, Todd, who seeks acceptance within a group. They emphasize the significance of the discovery of the secret club, the Dead Poets Society, as a turning point in the story. The hosts provide insights into the characters of Todd, Neil, and Dalton, representing different facets of Todd's personality - as Todd (Ethan Hawke) IS THE LEAD of the film too!
The Wiegand brothers, Jerome & Chris, love movies, and they are fascinated by human nature and the art of great storytelling. Have you ever wondered how great stories connect? Listen to the Silver Screen Happy Hour - a podcast for movie lovers!
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Transcript
In fact, another interesting note, Ethan Hawk's, not even the second billed.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Robert, Sean Leonard is, he's the third billed.
Jerome:The third.
Jerome:Ethan Hawk gets no love.
Jerome:He's the third billed and it's his film.
Jerome:Ethan Hawk, if you ever hear this, you are the lead, my friend.
Jerome:Yes, you are the lead in Dead Poet Society and you are the lead in Training Day.
Jerome:You should have got above the title on both of those.
Jerome:You should have got above Robin and above Denzel on both of those.
Jerome:Posters, but of course a last that would never happen to producers.
Jerome:They would never allow that.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And you, sir, I would've been like, who's this kid?
Jerome:You sir, have been screwed because you are the best actor, you are the
Jerome:lead in those and, and they're your films and they were robbed of you.
Jerome:And hopefully, thankfully people like me can see your greatness as
Jerome:the lead in both of these films.
Jerome:And I know that the screenwriters somewhere are saying, yes, of
Jerome:course, finally somebody gets it.
Jerome:But that, that's my, that's why I wanted to do an Ethan Hawk Day to show my
Jerome:love and appreciation for the guy that keeps getting noted as a supporting
Jerome:role in films that are obviously his.
Chris:Ha, well you are listening to, the Silver Screen Happy Hour.
Chris:I'm Chris Wiegand, along with my brother Jerome, who is a screenwriter and
Chris:graduate of Columbia College Chicago.
Chris:This is the show where we like to pair tasty adult beverages with a couple
Chris:of movies that have a similar theme.
Chris:So we encourage you, grab a drink and join us, unless of course you're driving,
Chris:then you get to be our designated driver.
Chris:we've called this episode Ethan Hawk Day, so I'm gonna get the recording
Chris:of the show on our film reel, and then we're gonna jump right in.
Chris:Enjoy the show.
Chris:Welcome back to another episode of the Silver Screen.
Chris:Happy hour.
Chris:I have really been looking forward to this episode.
Chris:Jar, we decided to take, what, two Ethan Hawk movies.
Chris:What?
Chris:What are those movies, Jerome?
Jerome:Today we're going to compare and contrast script structure and
Jerome:Ethan Hawk's role specifically.
Jerome:Yeah, in the 1989.
Jerome:Dead Poet Society.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:And training Day, which, 2001?
Jerome:I think.
Jerome:2001.
Jerome:Yes.
Jerome:2001 Training day.
Jerome:Yep.
Chris:So yeah, we might call it Ethan Hawk Day.
Chris:Let's see.
Chris:Dead Poets Day.
Chris:I don't know.
Chris:Anyway, I, so I had, I told.
Chris:Jerome, I had never seen Training Day, and so I was, you know,
Chris:I was looking forward to it.
Chris:I, I can't believe I'd never seen it.
Chris:It's just one of those movies.
Chris:When it came out my, I had babies and I didn't watch a lot of good movies.
Chris:I watched a lot of Disney movies, a lot of Pixar.
Chris:I think that's underst understandable.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:But no, I enjoyed it.
Chris:So I can't wait to jump into it.
Chris:So which one do you wanna tackle first?
Chris:I, I.
Chris:I know what I would've wanna do first.
Chris:It's fun to see what you wanna do first.
Jerome:I want to do dead poet Society first.
Jerome:Really?
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:But you wanna do training dead first or, well,
Chris:I just know, I think I have a lot more to say about the
Chris:the dead poets, but that's okay.
Chris:We can.
Jerome:Just jump in.
Jerome:No, let's actually start with training day and I'll tell you why.
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:So my drink of choice today, this is a real, yeah, let's get to that.
Jerome:I'm so excited about this.
Jerome:All right.
Jerome:I've been waiting for this.
Jerome:So in the movie training day, again, this is that part where we tell you guys,
Jerome:if you haven't, go watch the trailers.
Jerome:so you know what, what it's about.
Jerome:So we're talking about, but it's been 22 years since training day and.
Jerome:What, four 30 years since dead Post Society?
Jerome:So if we discuss about 40, what did I say?
Jerome:I said 30, didn't I?
Jerome:30?
Jerome:I said I thought you said 40.
Jerome:That's all right.
Jerome:It'd be almost 40, isn't it?
Jerome:It's like 35.
Jerome:Oh yeah.
Jerome:I'm getting old.
Jerome:34.
Jerome:34 years.
Jerome:Jesus.
Jerome:We're getting old.
Jerome:So if we discuss endings, particularly dead poets aside ending because it's
Jerome:real pertinent to what we're gonna talk about if you haven't seen it by now.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Sorry.
Jerome:But, but pause it and
Chris:go rent it or something.
Jerome:I mean, come on man.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Pause the show.
Jerome:Go watch it, and then come back and listen to us.
Jerome:It was, I
Chris:don't know if it's still on sale.
Chris:It was, it was like seven bucks to buy it on
Jerome:Amazon, but you can stream it.
Jerome:But it's a rental.
Jerome:It's like 3 99 to rent it on.
Jerome:On streaming.
Jerome:Yeah, but so,
Chris:oh, I'm talking about dead poets.
Chris:You're talking about training day.
Chris:Right.
Jerome:No, I was talking about Deb poets as well.
Jerome:Oh, okay.
Jerome:But, but let's cycle back to training day.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:So in training day, there's a scene where Denzel goes to see
Jerome:his buddy, Scott Glenn, right.
Jerome:And he says, you mind if I have some of your $300 bottle of, you know, stuff?
Jerome:I don't know what it is they're drinking.
Jerome:But in honor of that, do you have a $300 bottle of scotch?
Jerome:No, but I did.
Jerome:I am bringing out the special blue label.
Jerome:Ooh, Johnny Walker.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Blue.
Jerome:For those of you that are listening that are scotch drinkers, you
Jerome:know how beautiful this is?
Jerome:Oh my God.
Jerome:It's a, it's a good $200 bottle.
Jerome:I've never had that.
Jerome:I'm a little jealous.
Jerome:You can, you can get from like Costco or Sam's Club or somewhere
Jerome:for like, oh yeah, you got the.
Jerome:The Beast bottle.
Jerome:A dollar 80.
Jerome:Yes.
Jerome:This, I'm not drinking all this today.
Jerome:I would die.
Jerome:Oh yeah.
Jerome:So I am just going to have a small glass.
Jerome:I can't even have a big glass of this because it's that crazy.
Jerome:So while I get this bad boy opened up, cuz it's brand new.
Jerome:I haven't even taken this, this, this top off yet.
Jerome:You tell me what you're drinking.
Chris:Sure.
Chris:So in honor of Dead Poet Society, I was familiar with a beer out
Chris:of New Holland or Holland, a New Holland Brew Brewing company called
Chris:the Poet, American Oatmeal Stout.
Chris:And I already know it's delicious, but, we're gonna do the opening in the pour.
Chris:Yeah, lemme go ahead and it's in a can.
Chris:Okay.
Jerome:Ooh, yeah.
Jerome:Oh, that was nice.
Jerome:See here,
Chris:I'm going a little heavy on the poor.
Chris:Oh my.
Chris:Oh man.
Chris:Better slow it down.
Chris:There's a thick head on.
Chris:Oh man, that's filthy.
Chris:Two inch head right there.
Jerome:Yeah, that's filthy.
Jerome:You're filthy.
Jerome:That's dirty.
Jerome:Dirty.
Jerome:Three inch.
Jerome:Holy, dirty, dirty.
Chris:Oh, oh, hold on.
Jerome:anyone that's listened to more than one of our podcasts could tell you
Jerome:how much we sexualized the drinking part.
Jerome:That would be you, Jerome.
Jerome:Oh, I don't know.
Jerome:You over here with your two inches?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:All right.
Jerome:So my turn now, I don't know if you'll catch this.
Jerome:I don't know if you'll catch this on the microphone.
Jerome:I'm gonna take the top off.
Jerome:You ready?
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:Almost blew my
Jerome:eardrums out.
Jerome:Sorry.
Jerome:That was a good one now because it's Johnny Blue.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And again, for those of you listening who are Scott drinkers,
Jerome:you know, I cannot put this on ice.
Jerome:It's an abomination to put this on ice because you're bleeding it.
Jerome:You're bleeding water into a $200 bottle and this is too good.
Jerome:It's got you have, I disagree, but go on.
Jerome:You have to drink this.
Jerome:Neat.
Jerome:So here I'm gonna pour a little bit.
Jerome:Oh, oh yeah.
Jerome:That's a nice, did you even get, see, I can't even do a full glass of it.
Jerome:It's gotta be like, You know, otherwise by the end of the
Jerome:show I'm gonna be like slurring.
Jerome:I'm gonna be like, you remember Stallone and you're gonna be like, it's Ethan Hawk.
Jerome:And I'll be like, whatever, whatever.
Chris:So I disagree with you and putting ice or water in there.
Chris:I've actually heard people that like know their wine.
Chris:They're whiskey tasters and all that.
Chris:I forget what you call 'em.
Chris:I know a wine tasters are sommelier, right.
Chris:But they'll tell you that by at, by cutting it a little bit with water,
Chris:it does something with the flavor.
Chris:It's supposed to help you enjoy the flavor more.
Jerome:No,
Chris:that's, I know, I know, I know.
Chris:And that, so I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna, you know, argue with you,
Chris:especially with an expensive bottle.
Chris:But I have heard that before.
Jerome:Now I have used rocks.
Jerome:On a lot of different drinks.
Jerome:You know that?
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:I just can't, with blue, I, I would, I would, I would feel so guilty.
Jerome:Also, for those of you that know me so well by listening to these podcasts,
Jerome:you know that when this glass is done, I will bring out the cheap ass cold cans
Jerome:of beer in which I will take great light cracking open in front of this microphone.
Jerome:All right, here we go.
Jerome:Let's talk movies.
Jerome:Let's talk movies.
Jerome:Here we go.
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:Let's start with training day then.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:First of all, you said you hadn't seen it before and you finally
Jerome:watched it for the first time.
Jerome:Yep.
Jerome:What'd you think?
Jerome:What'd you think?
Chris:I, I loved it, obviously.
Chris:It's, it's about Ethan Hawk's first day on his new, new job assignment.
Chris:, what was his title?
Chris:Do you remember what his title was?
Chris:I mean, he was, he was, Joining Denzel Washington, who we find out is a corrupt
Chris:cop, undercover detective type cop.
Chris:Right.
Chris:He was off.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:It's, they were off.
Chris:They weren't, they weren't patrol cops
Jerome:is what I'm trying to do at No, no, it, it's, it appears to me a lot like
Jerome:the strike team on the show, the Shield.
Jerome:I don't know if you've ever watched that.
Jerome:They come off to me as like an anti-gang unit, anti-drugs,
Jerome:narcotics officers is what they are.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:They're undercover narcotics officers for the Los Angeles Police
Jerome:Department, and this is Ethan Hawk's.
Jerome:First day on the job and of.
Jerome:Course the squad leader is Denzel Washington and his Oscar
Jerome:winning performance best actor.
Jerome:Ethan Hawk, was nominated for best supporting actor, though, did not win.
Jerome:And then, and it's, it's all takes place in one day.
Jerome:And it is, of course, by the title.
Jerome:Training day.
Jerome:Yep.
Jerome:So why did we decide to have an Ethan Hawk Day?
Jerome:What prompted this?
Chris:You tell me.
Chris:Okay.
Chris:Jerome, actually, I, I know you, you told me why you did it, but
Chris:let's, let's tell everyone else.
Jerome:So, so first of all, I gotta tell you, I have a special love
Jerome:for Ethan Hawk, not just because I think his movies are great.
Jerome:But he's got this knack for being the supporting role in films
Jerome:where he's actually the lead.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:And I think he gets no justice sometimes.
Jerome:And that's why I picked these two movies because my argument today will
Jerome:try to prove to you all you writers out there in movie lovers and movie
Jerome:watchers, that Ethan Hawk is actually the lead in both of these films.
Jerome:Now, Robin Williams and Denzel Washington, respectively were both
Jerome:nominated for best actor for their films.
Jerome:Denzel won.
Jerome:Robin Williams lost, but they were both above the title.
Jerome:What I mean by that, those of you in the film industry know what I'm talking about.
Jerome:On the poster, they'll have the title of the movie right above the title
Jerome:means you are the number one person.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:You are the star.
Jerome:Your name is above the title, and everybody else's name is below the title.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Generally, you're supporting rules will be at the bottom.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:And my argument is that Robin Williams and Denzel.
Jerome:Are the stars of these films, but they're not the lead.
Jerome:And as from a screenwriter's point of view, my argument today, and you,
Jerome:your job will be to talk me out of it, is that Ethan Hawk is the lead.
Chris:So I am gonna argue you feel differently.
Chris:I am gonna argue with you, at least on dead poets.
Chris:I'm gonna, I'm gonna defend Mr.
Chris:Keating.
Chris:I'm gonna defend his honor.
Chris:I'm gonna get on my desk.
Jerome:Say no, he, no, he doesn't get on the desk at the end.
Jerome:He.
Jerome:Who?
Jerome:Robin.
Jerome:Robin Williams.
Jerome:Does he get on the desk?
Jerome:No, he
Chris:doesn't.
Chris:I'm gonna get on my desk and defend his honor.
Chris:Oh,
Jerome:okay.
Jerome:All right.
Chris:Okay, because I, I, so let's, I'll get into that one.
Chris:All right.
Chris:Let's start with training.
Chris:Get into it.
Chris:I think you have a better case for training day, however.
Chris:Anyways, go ahead and let's talk about it now.
Chris:Cause I am, I'm, I'm eager to argue with you about it a little bit.
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:So good.
Jerome:And I have, I have not only major points I, I will put to, to secure
Jerome:my case, but I also have the nail in the coffin at the end that will
Jerome:just destroy any argument you have.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:But, Before we get to that, so training day, right?
Jerome:So this, this is to me an obvious one only because the film starts
Jerome:and ends with Ethan Hawk, right?
Jerome:So what do we always talk about in script structure?
Jerome:We talk about theme in the first few minutes of the script, and then the
Jerome:character's growth and their journey.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:So did you pinpoint what you thought might be the theme when watching Training Day?
Jerome:What struck you as a possible line of dialogue?
Jerome:That is said to, in my opinion, the main character.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:So in the beginning, because I only watched it the one time , I was hoping to
Chris:get some time to kind of skim through it again, looking for those lines and stuff.
Chris:I can't remember.
Chris:Okay.
Chris:A specific line.
Chris:So if you, if you've got some I'm, it's okay.
Chris:I'm just bring it to me cuz I, I'll, it'll refresh my memory.
Chris:Cause I just watched it recently.
Jerome:I have the answers to the test.
Jerome:Good.
Jerome:So the wife in the opening scene, right?
Jerome:He gets up.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And he's getting ready.
Jerome:Ethan Hawk and sh Ethan Hawk is.
Jerome:Yeah, of course.
Jerome:He's the lead, right?
Jerome:So he's getting d he's getting dressed and, and his wife says to him something
Jerome:about this is a huge opportunity, but she says, don't screw this up.
Jerome:She says that specifically, don't screw this up.
Jerome:And why I take that is the theme is because remember, the theme isn't
Jerome:just whether or not they reach their tangible or spiritual goal.
Jerome:It is, but it's also that, that emotional tug of war throughout the film.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And if you watch training day, it's again, one of those.
Jerome:Tug push and pull things where half the scenes Denzel loves him and the other
Jerome:half of the scenes Denzel hates him.
Jerome:Yeah, right.
Jerome:Half the time he's screwing it up, quote unquote, and the other half, he's,
Jerome:he's winning, he's doing the job right.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:And they made it real obvious, the hi, him having his moral dilemma
Chris:crisis throughout the movie.
Chris:It's like, absolutely.
Chris:He's like, he.
Chris:Yeah, he would struggle and then he would like, okay, I guess this is, this is
Chris:crazy, but I guess this is the way it is.
Chris:Right.
Chris:And then he would go out and go along with it until, until
Chris:he reached a breaking point.
Jerome:Well, not even the breaking point throughout the film, there's
Jerome:times where he tries to push back.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And those are the times that Denzel gets pissed.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And he gets mad at him.
Jerome:And he's screwing this up.
Jerome:If you wanna be a part of my unit, you're gonna do what I say.
Jerome:Half the time he does, he just does it says, okay, I'll do it.
Jerome:I'll go along with this if this is how it is.
Jerome:So half the time.
Jerome:So it's that, and it's, again, we talked about this before.
Jerome:It's almost every other scene.
Jerome:Right, right, right.
Jerome:It's that back and forth, back and forth, which rising tension, you're, you're
Jerome:starting to get a little bit close to my, my nail in the coffin point, but
Jerome:when you said something, when you said he has this moral dilemma, Who doesn't
Jerome:have a moral dilemma at all in the film?
Jerome:Denzel.
Jerome:Denzel.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:This isn't a journey for Denzel, right?
Jerome:This is Ethan Hawk's journey.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Totally right.
Jerome:Yeah, totally.
Jerome:So I, I would say that the first, the first real jump to act too, when he first
Jerome:realizes that the world I'm in is not what I expected, it's when they're stopped in
Jerome:the middle of the intersection, gunned to his head, Denzel's, telling him to smoke.
Jerome:Crack.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:So at that point, that's a great scene, by the way.
Jerome:You know, and it's 17 minutes in, it's a little early for a first turning point.
Jerome:But in a film like this, you know, you gotta get to that second act.
Jerome:And you know, it's the second act when you're all of a sudden
Jerome:in a, in no man's land, right?
Jerome:You're, you're in a world you weren't expecting.
Jerome:It's completely different from the first day.
Chris:So in the past, haven't you usually said it was the halfway point?
Chris:That that would happen?
Jerome:No, no, no.
Jerome:Not the first turning point.
Jerome:Oh yeah.
Jerome:No.
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:Yeah, yeah, you're right.
Jerome:So the first turning point jumps you from act one to Act two.
Jerome:Act one, act two.
Jerome:Sure.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:So midpoint scene is generally where you kind of get your tangible goal,
Jerome:what you think you want, right?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:So what does Ethan Hawk want?
Jerome:He wants to be part of the team.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:Well, and I, I did go back and look at what was the midpoint scene, and that's
Chris:where he stood up to him after he.
Chris:After a Denzel murdered his buddy or whatever that guy's role was.
Chris:Was he a former cop?
Chris:The guy that he killed?
Jerome:Scott.
Jerome:Glenn, yeah.
Jerome:What was he?
Jerome:So the mid, the midpoint scene.
Jerome:That was the midpoint scene.
Jerome:It was actually, actually the midpoint scene is right before that.
Jerome:If you look at that, that was close.
Jerome:It's, it's, here's what you're doing.
Jerome:You're, you're taking account credits.
Jerome:I always find out when the credits start.
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Where it says directed by that to me is the end of the film.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And that's to me the minutes.
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:So then if you go back and look at the midpoint scene, it's actually before that.
Jerome:And it's when a Denzel meets with the three wise men because
Jerome:he's buying the warrant.
Jerome:To crash Roger's place.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Roger's an old war buddy.
Jerome:It's obvious that they were in Vietnam together.
Jerome:To me, that's what I got.
Jerome:And maybe not even they were in Vietnam together, but they were both in Vietnam.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And there's a brotherhood there, right?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Even if they didn't know each other in Vietnam, in fact, if they knew
Jerome:each other, I don't think any of this stuff goes down the way it did.
Jerome:Right, right.
Jerome:Because he talks about later how he talks about how.
Jerome:You know, I've watched that, you know, guy operate with impunity
Jerome:for 10 years and now I got him.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:He's, you know, this is check, this is chess, not checkers.
Jerome:So he's been playing this for 10 years, knowing that eventually a day
Jerome:would come, he was gonna rob his ass.
Jerome:Hmm.
Jerome:So, so it's obvious to me that they were both in Vietnam and
Jerome:there's that brotherhood there.
Jerome:That's why they talk to each other the way they do.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:But I don't think they were in the military together.
Jerome:That would be too close of a bond, I think, for either of them to break.
Jerome:But so getting back to Ethan Hawk's tangible goal is to
Jerome:be a part of the team, right?
Jerome:And at that moment, he feels like he is right, because they go to meet with.
Jerome:All the other guys in Denzel's, crew on the rooftop.
Jerome:And he was in the room.
Jerome:He's there.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:He, he was in the room to see the three Ys men.
Jerome:That's what I mean.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:And he was now included, he's part of the group.
Jerome:You are going with us on this raid.
Jerome:So he has what he thinks he wanted, which is his tangible goal.
Jerome:I wanna make this, I wanna be part of a team.
Jerome:But that's not his spiritual goal.
Jerome:Right, right, right.
Jerome:We all know come the ending.
Jerome:What his spiritual goal, what he did not know he needed.
Jerome:Was to not be a part of the team, but to bring the whole thing down.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:To be the hero that he didn't even know he needed to be, to take down the most
Jerome:corrupt cop in LA police department.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:Yep.
Jerome:Yep.
Jerome:So we all know what the all is lost scene is.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:That's where you feel like, I, I've lost everything.
Jerome:Everything is over.
Jerome:And that's when he gets dumped with the Mexicans in that apartment.
Jerome:Denzel sends him there to kill him, right?
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:I love that scene.
Chris:And one of the guys that had one of the actors I, I not noted was Tuko.
Chris:From Breaking Bad.
Jerome:From Breaking Bad.
Jerome:Tuco, I love Tuco and, and the main guy, cliff Curtis.
Jerome:I love Cliff Curtis cuz he can play any role.
Jerome:He's got that look, he's got that face and that mustache where he can play a Mexican.
Jerome:I've seen him play Arab.
Jerome:I've seen him play Italian.
Jerome:I've seen him play Egyptian.
Jerome:Like anything it, he can do anything.
Jerome:Like he's just, he can play a white dude.
Jerome:Like, it doesn't matter.
Jerome:Like he's just got that look that he can do anything and, and that.
Jerome:Scene, those guys play
Chris:well.
Chris:Don't that any, any, just any actor could do that.
Chris:God No.
Chris:That says a lot about his ability.
Chris:Yeah.
Jerome:Yes, yes.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And so, yeah.
Jerome:So that's a great scene and, and talk about the tension in that scene.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Where you, you know, he's dead.
Jerome:He's dead.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:There's no way, there's no way you're getting out of this.
Jerome:And they even show, what I love about the start of that scene is
Jerome:he tries to fight his way out.
Jerome:He hits the one guy and he tries to get out of there.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:And, and reality in an action film, he would get out of it.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:But this isn't an action film.
Jerome:This isn't fantasy land.
Jerome:This is reality where those guys drag him into the tub to kill him,
Jerome:and they're, and they're gonna blow his brains out with a shotgun.
Jerome:So, and then the whole thing with finding the, the cousin's wallet.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And it's just, so, yeah.
Jerome:It's such a great scene.
Chris:And that was kind of cool because he, so for those who hadn't seen it
Chris:earlier in the movie ear, very early in the movie, he saves a, a teenage
Chris:girl from being raped in an alley.
Chris:And, and as she runs away, he finds her wallet and he puts it in his pocket.
Chris:Well, and it was funny because in that scene it was part of that tug of war
Chris:where his partner didn't wanna stop.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:But he wanted to be, he wanted to be the moral guy.
Chris:And do you know that's why he signed up to be a cop.
Chris:He wanted to do shit like this.
Chris:He wanted to help people.
Chris:Yep.
Chris:And so he was, you know, doing what he felt he needed to do, took
Chris:care of business and save the girl.
Chris:Mm-hmm.
Chris:And he puts the wallet in his, in his pocket, and I forgot about it.
Chris:And that was kind of a, a clever, tool for, you know, just planning air.
Jerome:That's what they call Yeah.
Jerome:In-screen writing.
Jerome:Set it up in payoff.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:You do something early in the film that you know, the
Jerome:audience is gonna forget about.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:And then later it comes out, you're like, oh, I forgot about that.
Jerome:Because when he's in the, in wallet.
Chris:Yeah, when he's in the tub.
Chris:And I'm like, oh, he's toasted.
Jerome:They're gonna kill his ass.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:How's he gonna get outta this?
Jerome:He already punched him.
Jerome:They're gonna wax him, man.
Jerome:Yeah, he's, he's done.
Jerome:How is he gonna get out of this?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:I remember seeing that film in the theater and I'm in there going, He's dead.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:I guess this is how it's gonna end.
Jerome:Weird.
Jerome:Well, I remember thinking he can't die because he's Ethan Hawk and
Jerome:I remember thinking, I'm gonna be disappointed cuz somehow he's gonna get
Jerome:out of this and it's gonna be stupid.
Jerome:But when that pink wallet comes out of his pocket, I was like, oh, oh yeah.
Jerome:Oh, how did I not see that coming?
Jerome:Oh, they, they side they blindsided me and, and sure enough it all
Jerome:plays out and it's so great and I love at the end of that scene.
Jerome:Cliff Curtis is looking at him eye to eye and he says, you know,
Jerome:this shit was just business.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:You know that right?
Jerome:And he's, and he just, he barely can get a knot out of it cuz you know that
Jerome:his right, the anxiety has probably left all soul of his body is gone.
Jerome:Like he's just, he's barely got enough energy to say yes.
Jerome:Right, right.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Because he's so drained at that point.
Jerome:But as we talk about when you get to that all is lost scene.
Jerome:That's how they figure out the act, what they're, what's gonna
Jerome:catapult them into Act three.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:And there's always that moment that, you know, again, the old great
Jerome:screenwriting guru Blake Snyder used to call the Dark Night of the Soul.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:Where it's that moment between the all is lost and the jump to act three,
Jerome:where the main character has to decide, what am I going to do to finish this?
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:Or do I do anything?
Jerome:You know, and for him, that scene is the bus.
Jerome:He's on the bus all alone.
Jerome:And you're thinking he could go home.
Jerome:He could go home and say, you know what, I'm gonna go in tomorrow and quit.
Jerome:Or I'm gonna go in tomorrow and say, this is all, everything that happened.
Jerome:I could tell on everybody.
Jerome:I could do all these things.
Jerome:But he's like, no, no.
Jerome:I'm gonna go get that son of a bitch first because he was gonna have me
Jerome:killed and I have a little girl.
Jerome:Right, right.
Jerome:So, And he know, and he almost, he's, it's almost like a decision.
Jerome:He's, he's, he can't make, he's forced to do only one thing because of that.
Jerome:He knows, Denzel knows who he is.
Jerome:He knows Denzel knows he has a family.
Jerome:He has a kid, right.
Jerome:He's not leaving anything to chance.
Jerome:I have a grim thing that I'm gonna throw in at the end here, but.
Jerome:Before I get to that.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:So he goes to fulfill his spiritual goal of taking down Denzel.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:And that's, and that's him achieving his spiritual goal.
Jerome:And that's the end of the film.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:And it ends with him going home.
Jerome:Two things.
Jerome:Another thing that solidifies him being the lead in Denzel is
Jerome:actually the supporting role.
Jerome:Is we talk about the journey and the lesson that they learned.
Jerome:He obviously learned a very big lesson because throughout the film he's acting.
Jerome:I didn't know it was like this.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:You know, and at one point he even says, I'll go back and issue
Jerome:tickets as a patrolman again.
Jerome:I don't want to do this shit.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Right, right, right.
Jerome:He, he is learning the real shit of society.
Jerome:And he learns the le, the lesson he learns is that he has to become as
Jerome:bad as they are to take them down.
Jerome:And it's a line that Denzel says earlier in the film, to be a, to catch the
Jerome:wolf, you have to be the wolf, right?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:That's a little foreshadowing.
Jerome:It is because he's telling him what he's gonna have to do to take me
Jerome:if you're gonna take me, and even says, Godzilla ain't got shit on me.
Jerome:So he is telling him, you want somebody as bad as me, you gotta be as bad as me.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:So he fulfills that and that's his lesson.
Jerome:What?
Jerome:Here's my nail in the coffin on the point that he's the lead.
Jerome:Tell me, what lesson did Denzel learn at all in this film?
Jerome:Nothing.
Jerome:Nothing.
Jerome:He is the same as he is at the end.
Jerome:That he was at the beginning.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Still thinking that his shit don't stink and he's the boss and
Jerome:he can get away with anything.
Jerome:Yeah, and he can't.
Jerome:And he can't.
Jerome:So I guess if there is a lesson to be learned, it's
Jerome:that he finds out he's wrong.
Jerome:That's not a lesson.
Jerome:That's not a journey coming to self-discovery.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:So he doesn't learn a damn thing.
Jerome:So here's the grim thing I was gonna throw on the end here.
Jerome:Different from dead pose, society's ending.
Jerome:What do you think happens to Officer Hoyt or you know, detective
Jerome:Hoyt when all this is over?
Jerome:What do you mean?
Jerome:What do you think happens?
Jerome:I don't know.
Jerome:He, he, he's got the money.
Jerome:He's gonna go in the next day, presumably to the Iass department
Jerome:and say, I know you scraped his dead body off the ground last night.
Jerome:Riddled with Russian bullet holes, but there's more to it.
Jerome:Here's the money he stole from Roger.
Jerome:Everybody in his unit is corrupt.
Jerome:I'm gonna make a report and I'm gonna take 'em all down.
Jerome:What the hell do you think is gonna happen to Hoyt after that?
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:Same thing that happened to Sergo.
Jerome:He's gonna get shot in the face, right?
Jerome:Like, like there's cops don't as dirty as cops might be.
Jerome:The one thing they don't like is you ratting on other cops.
Chris:So that, and that was one thing I didn't like about the way it ended it.
Chris:So, and that's, so I like the movie, but there's a couple things there.
Chris:At the end, I felt like it was just loose ends.
Jerome:That's, I mean, that's the biggest loose end that you can think
Jerome:of is, yeah, this isn't over for
Chris:him.
Chris:Well there is also, like, there is the scene where Denzel
Chris:was basically surrounded.
Chris:By the people in that, that housing project, you know?
Chris:Right.
Chris:And, and I'm like,
Jerome:one of 'em was Terry Cruz, by the way,
Chris:and I was like, yeah.
Chris:And I'm like, okay, one, they're, he, they're gonna kill him here.
Chris:They didn't show how that ended.
Chris:He just, next scene, they show him walking down the street, so Oh, okay.
Chris:They let him go.
Chris:That was weird.
Chris:It looked like they were gonna kill him, but they didn't.
Chris:People started leaving one at a time, and then it was like, so you
Chris:could tell he lost his power there.
Chris:Denzel did.
Chris:Yes.
Chris:But, but anyways, I thought they were gonna kill him.
Chris:They didn't.
Chris:They let him go and then the Russians come and get 'em.
Chris:So it's like, yeah, okay.
Chris:That's all right.
Chris:It's just, it just seemed like a.
Chris:Writing, like little bit of a writing hole.
Chris:Maybe they an editing thing.
Chris:They just, I don't know.
Chris:It looked a little choppy
Jerome:to me, and, and I can understand why.
Jerome:They probably thought, you know what, for justice, the Russians
Jerome:have to be the ones to kill 'em.
Jerome:Yeah, right.
Jerome:It has to be, although it, although it's more poetic that
Jerome:the streets would've gotten 'em.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:They wanted to show that the Russians got 'em.
Jerome:But here's how I would've fixed it.
Jerome:As hokey as this might have been, it might have saved Hoyt's life.
Jerome:For the record, for those of you who haven't seen it, Hoyt doesn't die in the
Jerome:film, but I am assuming that he's going to because of what he's about to do.
Jerome:I, you could have fixed this by them killing him, right?
Jerome:On the street.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:Those, those guys, the street justice, they kill Alonzo and then the Russians
Jerome:take out the rest of his gang.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:The rest of his corrupt, Dr.
Jerome:Dre is one of 'em.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Peter Green, you know, you've seen Peter Green before.
Jerome:He's zed in, in Pulp Fiction.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:So, you know, I don't know how you would've made that
Jerome:flow, how it, how it works.
Jerome:That would be up to the director and, and, and they would
Jerome:probably say, nah, this sucks.
Jerome:Let's not do that.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:You know, but, but at least it would've gotten hok.
Jerome:Almost off Scot free to where there's nobody hunting him now,
Jerome:but you know, those other guys are all gonna hunt him now.
Jerome:Right, right, right.
Chris:That's why there wasn't a sequel.
Jerome:Right, right.
Jerome:There is a, well, there might have been a straight to video, I don't know, but,
Jerome:but that's the point is he is not just taking down Denzel who's already dead
Jerome:by the time this movie's ending, but he's gonna take down the whole crew.
Jerome:You know, he's ratting all those guys out.
Jerome:Yeah, right.
Jerome:So it's just a little grim thing of what do you think happens next?
Jerome:And I think Poor Officer Hoyt's gonna find his end pretty soon right after that.
Jerome:But that's a little, a little, a little grim after the credit's thought.
Jerome:but all, all in all,
Chris:I was gonna say before we move on, it was cool seeing, Snoop Dogg as a, as a,
Jerome:I, I don't, I don't think, you know how many people were in that film.
Jerome:I, I don't know how, I mean, how into r and b you are, but, was
Chris:surprised, for some reason it didn't click.
Chris:I knew she looked familiar, but Macy Gray, Macy Gray, SA
Jerome:Man's wife.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Yep.
Jerome:Macy Gray, Snoop Dogg, Dr.
Jerome:Dre is one of his group.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:There's, yep.
Jerome:Yep.
Chris:There's a few cameos in there.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:No, it was, it was cool.
Chris:Good cast.
Chris:Definitely a good cast.
Jerome:So did I at least prove my point that he is the
Jerome:supporting role in this film?
Chris:Yeah, I totally bought that.
Chris:So, and you know, like you said, and, and I see your case for the next film
Chris:we're gonna talk about, because a lot of the same things apply to Ethan Hawk in
Chris:the, in the in Dead Poet society, Ethan
Jerome:Hawk, who gets no love.
Chris:Well, and you're right cuz if you, if you wanna jump right
Chris:into it, Ethan Hawk, the movie does kind of start and end with him.
Chris:Right.
Chris:Yes.
Chris:Yep.
Chris:Because he's the, I think he's the last shot that you see of his face.
Jerome:He is the last shot.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:In, in dead poets.
Chris:So the thing, if you, you, you wanna jump into it?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Let's, let's get into, let's do, since this one's older, we may have
Jerome:to do a little bit of a recap for those of you go who haven't seen,
Chris:yeah.
Chris:Go ahead and give him a recap of Dead Poet's Society.
Jerome:So the Walton, I believe it's called the Walton Academy, is, is a prep
Jerome:school for high schoolers, basically.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:It's a college preparatory school, but it's, it's didn't,
Chris:I think they didn't they have younger classes?
Chris:Cause I remember seeing younger boys.
Jerome:Yeah, well, like a high school.
Jerome:Like a high school.
Jerome:There's like freshman and sophomores and juniors.
Chris:No, these were really young kids.
Chris:There were some scenes with really young kids and I thought maybe they had
Chris:had a separate like grade school too.
Jerome:If they may have, I don't think they elaborated on it, or it could just
Jerome:be those are the real gifted kids, right?
Jerome:Because this is supposed to be a school for smart.
Jerome:As kids.
Jerome:Right, right, right.
Jerome:The ones that are gonna go to Harvard.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:That's the whole point.
Jerome:These kids are all going to Harvard.
Chris:It takes, it takes place like in the fifties?
Jerome:Forties or fifties.
Jerome:Something like that.
Jerome:Yeah, something like that.
Jerome:Yeah, something like that.
Jerome:So it's an older, it's a, it's sort of a period film.
Jerome:A a, a bit.
Jerome:But so what it is, is this, there's an opening in the English department
Jerome:and John Keating is a professor who comes, who had been working in London.
Jerome:He's an American who was working in London.
Jerome:He comes back to the New England area.
Jerome:I want to say it is, and he takes over to teach English, specifically
Jerome:literature and poetry at this school to prepare these kids for college.
Jerome:The biggest mishmash is that he's into original thinking and being your
Jerome:own person and breaking of conformity and of course the headmaster and
Jerome:everybody, every other teacher in the school is like, what are you doing?
Jerome:Oh my God.
Jerome:Like you can't tell a 17 year old.
Jerome:You can do whatever the hell he wants.
Jerome:Yeah, like it's, we believe the tradition thank for themselves.
Jerome:Yes, we, I mean, right off the bat, the movie opens with this big
Jerome:assembly and they nail down the four pillars, tradition, honor.
Jerome:Discipline excellence.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:These are, this is the motto for the school.
Jerome:And that's the opening scene.
Jerome:Yeah, that's the opening scene.
Jerome:They're nailing down already that this is how this school is.
Jerome:Now, you could say that John Keating does make an appearance before Ethan Hawk, but
Jerome:it's only in as an introduction, like, Hey, we have a new teacher with us and he
Jerome:smiles and shakes his head, you know, nods his head and everybody claps or whatever.
Jerome:We have a new teacher.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:But he doesn't speak.
Jerome:He has no speaking part in that shot.
Jerome:Ethan Hawk's character.
Jerome:However, as the assembly is closing out, it's the opening scene for him.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:he meets the headmaster, or the headmaster already knows who he
Jerome:is because his brother went there.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:His brother was a big Yeah.
Jerome:He's a valedictorian.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Big of his class.
Jerome:Exactly.
Jerome:A big who's who in that school.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And here comes the theme.
Jerome:What does the headmaster say?
Jerome:And, and it's almost.
Jerome:You know what?
Jerome:I actually wrote this down.
Jerome:Four minutes and 57 seconds in, it's almost exactly five minutes.
Jerome:We talk about the theme being dedicated in the first five minutes.
Jerome:This is what the headmaster says to him, and I quote, you
Jerome:have some big shoes to fill.
Jerome:Young man.
Jerome:Your brother was one of our finest.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Think about that for a second.
Jerome:And you know how the movie ends, right?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Okay, so, so right off the bat, five minutes in, he gives
Jerome:this this sort of theme, right?
Jerome:So, Once again, we start doing the back and forth, right?
Jerome:Is he gonna be filling his brother's shoes?
Jerome:Is he not?
Jerome:Is he gonna be an important member?
Jerome:Is he not?
Jerome:His tangible goal is an obvious one.
Jerome:He wants to be accepted within the group, right?
Jerome:He's so shy, he can't break out of his shell, right?
Jerome:He wants to be part of the group.
Jerome:The first turning point that I saw, Is, Neil, his friend, and by the way, we're
Jerome:gonna get to this a little bit later.
Jerome:God, I love, I love the Dyna.
Jerome:This is such a fantastic screenplay.
Jerome:Tom Schulman wrote the script and he won best screenplay for this, and it's so when
Jerome:I watched this film, they should really teach this in film school because this,
Jerome:this, it's so perfect the way he wrote all this out, but Neil, And I'm sure a
Jerome:lot of this, by the way, has to do with Peter Weir, the director Now, you know
Jerome:Peter Weir, we've talked about him before.
Jerome:He did Witness and Mosquito Coast.
Jerome:Yeah, he's the dir.
Jerome:He's the director of Dead Post Society.
Jerome:So you know that obviously it takes a great director to bring
Jerome:out the great elements of a screenplay and put them on film.
Jerome:So we're gonna give credit to Peter Weir as as well.
Jerome:But the script is so fantastic, but Neil discovers the Dead Poet Society.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:That to me is, is the transition to act two.
Jerome:Another side point, I made a note here, it's a little creepy.
Jerome:Before we get to that, the very first class they have with Keating, he drags
Jerome:all the boys down and starts showing 'em the pictures of all the previous people.
Jerome:Right, right, right.
Jerome:That are long since dead, right?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:When he says, and I quote, I wrote this down.
Jerome:He says, someday we'll all stop breathing and die when
Jerome:he says that the camera is on.
Jerome:Robert, Sean, Leonard.
Jerome:Wow.
Jerome:Yes.
Jerome:I didn't catch that.
Jerome:Yes.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:But anyway, I just thought that was creepy.
Jerome:And then so, so they discovered the Dead Poet Society and Neil is starting to prod
Jerome:Todd, who's Ethan Hawk, and he's hesitant.
Jerome:But he relents.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:That's, yeah, that's, he makes the decision to go.
Jerome:They always say you can't force somebody into Act two.
Jerome:They have to do it willingly.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:And although he's pr, he doesn't feel like he wants to be a part of it.
Jerome:He does make the decision.
Jerome:Ethan Hawk does.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:He makes the decision to go along and be a part of this dead pose
Jerome:society because he wants so badly to be accepted as part of the group.
Jerome:Right, right.
Jerome:I don't know.
Jerome:If you looked at minutes again, what would you say was the midpoint scene?
Jerome:It's about an hour in.
Jerome:Do a two hour film.
Jerome:Hang on a second.
Jerome:This is for you.
Jerome:Now, for those of you, like I said, you heard at the beginning, I am
Jerome:now cracking into the beer because if I keep going with this scotch,
Jerome:it's gonna be a Blubbery show.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:I'm gonna open my second poet.
Jerome:Oh man.
Chris:So what was the midpoint scene?
Chris:I thought I wrote it down, but I didn't.
Jerome:So I have, it's the Yawp scene, right?
Chris:Oh, where he is getting his voice?
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:Where he writes teaching how to, how to find his voice.
Jerome:And he writes Walt Whitman's name.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:On the thing.
Jerome:The reason why that's so important is leading up to that, he's trying
Jerome:to write poetry, but he's shy.
Jerome:He doesn't wanna read in front of the class, right?
Jerome:Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Jerome:And Robin Williams forces him out of his shell.
Jerome:He forces him to stand up, and he does the whole thing from Walt
Jerome:Whitman about I, I will yell my barbaric yelp over the hilltops, or
Jerome:whatever, you know, whatever it is.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And he keeps pressing and pressing and pressing, and he's
Jerome:forcing him to do poetry, right?
Jerome:And what happens?
Jerome:He actually gives a great Yes.
Jerome:Line of poetry straight out of his head.
Jerome:Yep.
Jerome:And right when it's done, as everyone's cheering, Robin Williams grabs him by
Jerome:the head and goes, don't forget this.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And it's so like that to me is he's achieved, he's now part of the group.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:He achieved his tangible goal.
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Now we all know that what happens in the second act or the second
Jerome:half of the second act, right.
Chris:Well, not everybody.
Chris:If you haven't seen it, you should probably pause.
Chris:Go watch the movie right now because it gets, it gets rough.
Jerome:It does.
Jerome:So here's where you would have a, a more of a solid argument on why Robin Williams
Jerome:character John Keating is the lead.
Jerome:Because I know, I, I've anticipated what I felt your argument would be, and
Jerome:that is the second half of the film.
Jerome:We deal with more than just Ethan Hawk, right?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:It's Knox over Overstreets attempt to woo the girl.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:It's Dalton's attempts to thumb his nose at, at, at authority, right?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:It's, it's, it's all these things.
Jerome:Here is my take on that though.
Jerome:Are you ready?
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:This is gonna blow your mind.
Jerome:Every boy in the group is part of Ethan Hawk's personality.
Jerome:What?
Jerome:They're all, all manifested in different people.
Jerome:So Knox represents.
Jerome:The guy that wants to get the girl.
Jerome:Dalton represents the loud leader right now.
Jerome:This is gonna be important in a minute.
Jerome:This is gonna be important later.
Jerome:Dalton, I meant to say Dalton.
Jerome:Did I say Knox?
Jerome:Knox is the one that're trying to get the girl.
Jerome:Dalton represents the thumbing authority, and I'm loud and bombastic,
Jerome:and I lead with my brara, right?
Jerome:I lead with my voice.
Jerome:Neil is a quiet leader.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:Ethan Hawk even says that to him.
Jerome:You speak and people listen.
Jerome:I'm not like that.
Jerome:And Neil says, don't you think you could be?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And he says, I don't know, maybe.
Jerome:But the point is, there's nothing you can do about it.
Jerome:He's actually dictating that I'm the one that has to do this.
Jerome:I'm the one that has to make this decision.
Jerome:If I'm gonna be like you, it's gotta come from here.
Jerome:It's gotta come from me.
Jerome:You can't make me this.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:So Neil and Dalton represent, it's kind of like when people used to say, People
Jerome:used to say, like they used to talk about all the time in Platoon, right?
Jerome:Charlie Sheen.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Willem Defoe and Tom Beringer were like two dads.
Jerome:To him, they were father figures.
Jerome:One was the passive, sort of the, the liberal kind.
Jerome:You know, the war is bad, but we need to help these people.
Jerome:And Tom Baringer represented the rage.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:I will kill anybody that gets in our way.
Jerome:I'll protect the platoon any way I can, even if it's corrupt.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:So they both served as two father figures to Charlie Sheen's central character.
Jerome:That's how I feel.
Jerome:Dalton and Neil are to Ethan Hawk.
Jerome:They both represent leaders, but one of them's the loud leader and one of
Jerome:them's a quiet leader, but, Ethan Hawk at this point is not a leader at all.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:And that's his spiritual goal.
Jerome:What he did not know he needed was to be the leader.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:No,
Chris:I, so yeah, I get that.
Chris:And so in, let me tell you what I wrote down about, so I think one of
Chris:the geniuses genius things about this movie is, I mean, it's, it's layered.
Chris:So you could say that, you know, the theme or the, the, the story is
Chris:all about Ethan's Hawk's character, and he didn't have a voice.
Chris:He wants a voice.
Chris:He finds his voice, you know, that whole journey.
Chris:But you could also argue that it's, it's Robin Williams.
Chris:Story of, I mean, it's the story of, of his, he's the, the lead
Chris:protagonist in a culture war.
Chris:A war of worldviews.
Chris:Because the, the opening scene has, like you said, the, the
Chris:four pillars, tradition, honor, discipline, and excellence.
Chris:And then you kind of, What do you call that?
Chris:Jux?
Chris:Jux Juxtapose.
Chris:Juxtaposition.
Chris:Juxtaposition.
Chris:That's what it is to the whole carpe diem scene, right?
Chris:With Robin Williams and, and there is a line that he had in there, and I loved it.
Chris:I wrote it down.
Chris:Robin Williams was talking to the boys.
Chris:He said, we don't read and write poetry because it's cute.
Chris:We read and write poetry because we are members of the human race,
Chris:of the human race, and the human race is filled with passion.
Chris:And medicine, law, business engineering.
Chris:These are, these are noble pursuits and necessary to sustain life.
Chris:I know this line, but poetry, beauty, romance, romance, love.
Chris:These are what we Stay alive.
Chris:You stay alive
Jerome:for.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:It's like, ah, yeah.
Jerome:You know, but you, but did you continue?
Jerome:Because the end of that is even better.
Jerome:What's the end of that?
Jerome:I didn't
Chris:finish the quote, so I didn't, the end, the quote is the best.
Chris:Well, I know he went on to quote
Jerome:what Whitman right?
Jerome:No, but he says, yeah.
Jerome:He says the powerful play goes on.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And you may contribute a verse.
Jerome:Yes.
Jerome:And then he repeats the line again.
Jerome:You may contribute a verse and then he looks right at Ethan Hawk.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And says, what will your verse be?
Chris:So it's interesting though.
Chris:So the.
Chris:The, those four things that Robin Williams said, poetry, beauty, romance, and love.
Chris:I noted that those are four things that were lost or what Neil lost
Chris:by his father's harsh words.
Chris:He felt hopeless.
Chris:He, he, you know, so like, In the, the Battle of Worldviews that was
Chris:going on, that was kind of the overarching theme of the movie, right?
Chris:The battle of, of worldviews and, and you know, is it tradition,
Chris:honor, discipline, and excellence?
Chris:Or is it poetry, beauty, romance, and love?
Chris:Well, you can, you can appro, you can hold tradition, honor,
Chris:discipline, and excellence with poetry, beauty, romance, and love.
Chris:But to do that without it is very cold and harsh.
Chris:Right.
Chris:So yes, it, it was, it was a, it was a great overarching
Chris:theme to the movie, right?
Chris:So, yeah, so I, I wrote, I'm just looking at some of my other notes.
Jerome:So let's, let's kind of jump a little bit forward.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:To the all is lost scene and we all know what that is, right?
Jerome:This is Neil's exit from the film and it's worse.
Jerome:It's Todd's first real dealing with pain.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Who wakes Todd up to tell him?
Jerome:Dalton.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Because again, these are the two leaders, the quiet leader
Jerome:and the overarching leader right
Chris:before you, before you go into the analysis here.
Chris:I mean, let's just say it out loud, what we're talking about because uh,
Chris:you know, even if people have seen it, you know, he, what's his Neil?
Chris:yes.
Chris:Took his own life.
Chris:Yes.
Chris:And it was, it's, so, it's funny cuz I, when I saw this movie
Chris:the first time I was a teenager.
Chris:so it hits you a certain way when you see a fellow teenager take his own life?
Chris:Yes.
Chris:Because we, we probably all experienced that, lost someone we knew.
Chris:Teenager or adult,
Jerome:or feelings yourselves.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:you know, there's so many teens that go through this feeling
Jerome:of, I just wanna end it.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:I gotta say
Chris:watching it now after having teenagers.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:It's so weighty.
Chris:That whole scene just.
Chris:It fucked me up.
Chris:I was like,
Jerome:oh my God, man, it's, it's hard.
Jerome:It's like when we were talking about promising young woman.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:You know, when you're a parent now and you watch this shit,
Jerome:it, it's, it's scary as fuck.
Jerome:So, yeah.
Jerome:To dig a little bit deeper into that, he has the play of his life.
Jerome:He goes against his father's wishes and acts and a play.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:He's the lead.
Jerome:He's puck and Midsummer Night Dream.
Jerome:Excuse me.
Jerome:And he nails it.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:He nails it.
Jerome:Absolutely.
Jerome:It, it confirms his belief that this is something he could
Jerome:do for the rest of his life.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:His father doesn't approve.
Jerome:He tells him, I'm gonna take you out of that school.
Jerome:Right, right.
Jerome:I'm gonna go put you in a military academy where you can learn discipline,
Jerome:cuz obviously you haven't learned discipline enough cuz I told you no
Jerome:and you're not listening and I'm blah.
Jerome:And he kills himself.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:It's the way that scene is shot too.
Jerome:The way Peter Weir shoots that scene.
Jerome:Oh my God.
Jerome:Is E is even more haunting than the concept itself.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Because for the first time, the only time in that film, we see anything
Jerome:from the father's point of view.
Jerome:And it's, it's not from Neil's point of view at all.
Jerome:It ain't from Keating's or anybody else's point of view.
Jerome:It's the father who jumps awake in the middle of the night because
Jerome:he thought he heard something.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:We as an audience don't hear anything.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And I'm glad we don't because it would've been cheesy for us to hear the gunshot.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:We don't.
Jerome:We just see him jump up.
Chris:Well, and what that did in that instance, in that moment,
Chris:it shifted your vantage point.
Chris:You became his dad's vantage point.
Chris:Yes.
Chris:Because you didn't hear it, but you were startled.
Chris:Right?
Chris:Right.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:Just like he was, and you're like, oh, what
Jerome:happened?
Jerome:Exactly.
Jerome:And he says, what was that noise?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And the mom's like, what noise?
Jerome:I didn't hear anything.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:But he immediately gets up, he starts going through the house.
Jerome:He can't find Neil.
Jerome:And then when he opens his study down in the basement, the first thing he does is
Jerome:go, because he can smell the gunpowder.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:And then all he see and can see the smoke too.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:From the other side of the desk, you just see smoke coming up.
Jerome:We don't see any blood.
Jerome:We don't see him actually do it.
Jerome:We don't even see, for the most part, we don't even see the body.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:The, the way Peter Weir shoots it from behind the desk.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:We just see the dad picking him up.
Jerome:Oh yeah.
Jerome:And hi his, oh yeah.
Jerome:You know, and it's so, it's so heartbreaking, and the
Jerome:mom just can't accept it.
Jerome:You know what I mean?
Jerome:She just keeps saying, he's all right.
Jerome:He's all right.
Jerome:He's all right.
Jerome:You know what I mean?
Jerome:Like it's that, it's that defense mechanism that people have, right?
Jerome:To say everything's gonna be okay when, you know, it's obviously not right.
Jerome:So it's a hard scene to watch it's shot amazingly.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:But let's jump past this now.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And let's get back to Ethan Hawk.
Jerome:Dalton wakes him up in the middle of the night and tells him the bad news.
Jerome:So, That's the all is lost for Ethan Hawk, and it presents the jump to Act three,
Jerome:which is, how am I gonna deal with this?
Jerome:How am I going?
Jerome:He's still in that dark night of the soul.
Jerome:He doesn't know yet how he's gonna respond and why doesn't he know?
Jerome:Because Dalton's still there.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:That's why it's key that Dalton punches Cameron because his expulsion, and
Jerome:they do a great shot of this too.
Jerome:Peter Weir does a great shot of this.
Jerome:At the end, they show Dalton's empty seat in the classroom.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:To dictate the other leader is gone now.
Jerome:Now Todd Anderson has no leaders left.
Jerome:Yep.
Jerome:Neil's gone and now Dalton's gone.
Jerome:So who is left to lead this group?
Jerome:And that's what catapults him into the, his achieving his spiritual goal.
Jerome:He's the.
Jerome:First to stand up on the desk.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And even when the teacher tell he's the first to stand up and when the teacher
Jerome:tells him to sit down, he does sit down, but then that's not the end of it.
Jerome:He gets up on the desk and he leads everybody else getting up
Jerome:to, yeah, with the O captain, my captain, and it's just an amazingly
Jerome:fantastic final scene and, and here.
Jerome:Here is why I say, here's why I have to nail him.
Jerome:The coffin argument that it's Ethan Hawks movie.
Jerome:He fulfills everything we just talked about.
Jerome:We just got done talking about the journey, right?
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:He fulfills this journey, his tangible goal of being part of the group and his
Jerome:spiritual goal of leading the group.
Jerome:He achieves all of that.
Jerome:It ends on his face as the final shot.
Jerome:But more importantly, and this is, this is what got me to really confirm.
Jerome:This is my nail in the coffin.
Jerome:He obviously learns a lot on this journey.
Jerome:I'm not sure John Keating learns anything that he wasn't already
Jerome:aware of at the beginning.
Jerome:Hmm.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:Because if anything, Ethan Hawk standing on that desk solidified to him that his
Jerome:teachings were right from the beginning.
Jerome:Yep.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Okay.
Jerome:At no, at no point you will does John.
Chris:I'm not worthy.
Chris:I'm not worthy
Jerome:there.
Jerome:At no point, at no point does John Keating stop and say, well, a kid died.
Jerome:Maybe I shouldn't teach this breaking of conformity stuff.
Jerome:No.
Jerome:In fact, it solidifies it.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And, and you think, you know, we talked about training day.
Jerome:What would be the next step for Hoyt after the credits roll?
Jerome:What's the next step for Keating?
Jerome:Shit, he probably goes back to London where everybody is free
Jerome:from conformity, or at least that's where he was for however many years.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:He goes back to see his wife, right?
Jerome:And, and you know, he probably, or he stays in the States and he finds
Jerome:a school that's not so damn rigid.
Jerome:He doesn't, to him, it's not a lesson that needs to be learned.
Jerome:If anything, it solidifies the fact that this is why kids need to be.
Jerome:Need to grow.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:This is why you can't ham, hand, hand, you know, chain down a child.
Jerome:Let them learn.
Jerome:Let them become themselves.
Jerome:This is what I've been teaching from day one, and this proves
Jerome:that I was a good teacher at it.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:So if anything, it solidifies who he already was.
Chris:Yeah.
Chris:Although he was fired, he, he did get the gratification of seeing that
Chris:he did have an effect on these boys.
Jerome:He succeeded at exactly on what he wanted, what he set out from day one.
Jerome:If you watch their very first class Yep.
Jerome:He takes them out of the class and takes 'em down to show them all those pre, and
Jerome:he says, make your lives extraordinary.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:That's the blessing from the first time we see him teach and it's, and it's
Jerome:comes to fruition in the final scene.
Jerome:Yeah.
Chris:Good analysis, man.
Chris:I had a, I love that movie.
Chris:I had a hard time, Conceding on this one, just cuz I, well, I love Robin
Chris:William's character so much, and that whole overarching theme of, you know,
Chris:he was the lead protagonist when it came to the battle of the of the world.
Jerome:But isn't he kind of like obiwan?
Jerome:Yeah, I know.
Jerome:So, and, and Ethan Hawk is like Luke, right?
Jerome:It's, I mean, if you think about it from that point of view.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And remember, so here's why I wanted to talk about, I'm not gonna do a
Jerome:deep dive analysis, but Goodwill hunting is similar in this aspect that
Jerome:it came out almost 10 years later.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:And Robin Williams is no longer the lead.
Jerome:Now he's the supporting role.
Jerome:In fact, he wins best supporting actor for Goodwill hunting.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:It's almost the same movie in a sense of he's trying to draw out
Jerome:the insides of somebody who's trying to keep their insides down.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:Right, right.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Matt Damon's character is trying to bury who he truly is inside.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:He's trying to bury it down and Robin Williams is trying to bring it out.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:And that's what he does with Ethan Hawk.
Jerome:The difference 10 years later is Robin Williams isn't the lead.
Jerome:He is the supporting role and just fully wins, best supporting actor.
Jerome:I think Dead post society.
Jerome:He's also the supporting role, but because he was Robin Williams and Ethan
Jerome:Hawk was on his only, his second film after Explorers, which was four years
Jerome:earlier, he hadn't done shit in that time.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And you know, that's why Ethan Hawk's not gonna get the lead.
Jerome:In fact, another interesting note, Ethan Hawk's, not even the second build.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Robert, Sean Leonard is, he's the third build.
Jerome:The third.
Jerome:Ethan Hawk gets no love.
Jerome:He's the third build and it's his film.
Jerome:Ethan Hawk, if you ever hear this, you are the lead, my friend.
Jerome:Yes, you are the lead in, but.
Jerome:Dead post society and you are the lead in training day.
Jerome:You should have got above the title on both of those.
Jerome:You should have got above Robin and above Denzel on both of those posters.
Jerome:But of course a last that would never happen to producers
Jerome:that would never allow that.
Jerome:Yeah, and you, sir, I've been like, who's this kid?
Jerome:You, sir, have been screwed because you are the best actor.
Jerome:You are the lead in those.
Jerome:And, and they're your films and they were robbed of you.
Jerome:And hopefully, thankfully people like me can see your greatness as
Jerome:the lead in both of these films.
Jerome:And I know that the screenwriters somewhere are saying, yes, of
Jerome:course, finally somebody gets it.
Jerome:But that, that's my, that's why I wanted to do an Ethan Hawk Day to show my
Jerome:love and appreciation for the guy that keeps getting noted as a supporting
Jerome:role in films that are obviously his.
Jerome:Yeah.
Chris:Yep.
Chris:So well done.
Chris:So you wanna jump to Six Degrees?
Jerome:Wait, before we get to that, so there's another interesting element
Jerome:that I took down a lot of notes.
Jerome:This solidified my argument as I was watching Dead Post Society
Jerome:for probably a millionth time and for preparation for this show.
Jerome:Why I, I led to, I was led to believe because I was
Jerome:battling in that second half.
Jerome:I'm like, man, there's a lot to do about Knox and the Girl.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:That has nothing to do with heat and Hawk.
Jerome:There's a lot about, you know, I don't know, there's a lot of focus
Jerome:on Dalton and Meeks and Cameron, and I'm like, and then it dawned on me,
Jerome:wait a minute, something happened that made me think, wait a second.
Jerome:This is an element here.
Jerome:There's an element I'm missing.
Jerome:And I, and I, and I think I'm picking it up, that all these
Jerome:boys are part of Ethan Hawk's personality, and you know why he is.
Jerome:The mixture of all of those people mixed into one.
Jerome:You know how I finally, well, how it finally dawned on me, Hmm.
Jerome:It occurred to me that chemistry is in the background of every one of these scenes.
Jerome:So, and I wrote the, I went back to look.
Jerome:The chemistry book makes several appearances.
Jerome:In Todd's sees the day moment.
Jerome:It's in, it's, it's where he's sitting at his desk and he writes,
Jerome:sees the day on the notebook.
Jerome:Hmm.
Jerome:His chemistry book is right there in plain view.
Jerome:It's the only side binding you can read.
Jerome:There's a stack of textbooks, but the chemistry one is a
Jerome:big red book Cameron says.
Jerome:That he, when everybody's running around the room.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:When Neil says, oh, he is writing poetry, and they start running
Jerome:around, you know, and they're throwing the notebook back and forth.
Jerome:Cameron comes in and says, I need to study my chemistry.
Jerome:What are you guys doing?
Jerome:Yeah, the chemistry book is in Neil's desk after he died, and Robin
Jerome:Williams sits down and he opens his desk and he pulls out that book
Jerome:with the notation from Thoreau.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:About going to the woods cuz I wanted to live deliberately when he pulls the book,
Jerome:if the chemistry book is there in his desk and at the end when Dalton punches
Jerome:Cameron, he's late to that meeting and he said, oh look who finally showed up?
Jerome:And what does Dalton say?
Jerome:I was studying for my chemistry exam.
Jerome:So chemistry is make several points throughout mentions, and it started
Jerome:to dawn on me that this is a theme.
Jerome:Mm-hmm.
Jerome:That either Peter Weir did this on purpose or it was in the script, but.
Jerome:It.
Jerome:There's a theme here that all the boys in this group, the Dead Poet
Jerome:Society Chemistry, is, it's mixing all these personalities into one.
Jerome:They're all elements in his personality.
Jerome:They're all elements in Ethan Hawk's personality, and
Jerome:that's why that's pretty cool.
Jerome:We take the time in the second half of the film to to, to delve.
Jerome:To delve off and, and talk about each one of these different personalities cuz
Jerome:they're all part of Ethan Hawk in the end.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Yeah, I mean, so if you haven't seen that Post Society folks see it.
Jerome:Honestly, one of
Chris:my all time favorites, honestly, it's up there.
Chris:It's,
Jerome:it's great.
Jerome:And like I said, they should teach this script in film school.
Jerome:Now, when I went to film school, the obvious ones were Witness
Jerome:and Tootsie and African Queen.
Jerome:And of course, star Wars was mentioned a lot in the hero journey, right?
Jerome:So when you're writing screenplays, those are the.
Jerome:Though the ones I mentioned, particularly Witness and Tootsie and African Queen
Jerome:about, great solid three act structures.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:And they teach those in, in the film school.
Jerome:When I was in school, they really should teach Dead Poet's Society
Jerome:because it's so, it's so perfect as far as maybe they do now development.
Jerome:Who knows?
Jerome:Maybe they don't.
Jerome:Maybe they, they should.
Chris:Oh boy.
Chris:So six degrees.
Jerome:All right.
Jerome:What do you got?
Chris:So, I, I just, when you asked me what two actors we should try to
Chris:connect, I just, I was like, well, I, I thought about it and I just came up with
Chris:the two actors that die in the movies.
Chris:In both movies.
Chris:Okay.
Chris:So what was it?
Chris:It was, well,
Jerome:Neil.
Jerome:Yeah.
Chris:Robert, Sean Leonard, Robert O Sean Leonard, and then Scott Glenn in
Jerome:the other one.
Jerome:So for the record, for anyone listening, this was thrown together right at
Jerome:the last minute with Zero Prep.
Jerome:The good news is that the two people you picked, now we have a rule too,
Jerome:that if we're discussing two movies, we generally can't use those movies.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Because, and we can't use the person we're talking about.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:The hawk in both of them.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:So I can't use Ethan Hawk cuz obviously I could.
Jerome:Oh well, Ethan Hawk.
Jerome:Well there you go.
Jerome:Right.
Jerome:So I can't use Ethan Hawk and I can't use either film.
Jerome:But this was still relatively easily because Robert, Sean Leonard
Jerome:from the late eighties, early nineties was in a lot of movies.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And particularly much to Do About Nothing, which was a Shakespeare
Jerome:movie that Kenneth Brona did.
Jerome:Which is ironic because of Dead Post Society.
Jerome:Right?
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:Where he plays Puck and Mid-Summer Night's Dream much to do about, about Nothing.
Jerome:Had Emma Thompson in it.
Jerome:Emma Thompson, as you know, is and Remains of the Day with Anthony
Jerome:Hopkins, and that's the third connection is Silence of the Lambs.
Jerome:Anthony Hopkins and Scott Glenn were both in Sounds, soul Lambs.
Jerome:Yeah, I
Chris:knew if I, I figured it probably would
Jerome:be.
Jerome:I just, when you said Scott Glenn, the first thing I
Jerome:thought of was sound soul lambs.
Jerome:Cause even though the dude's got a huge career, he's been in a million movies.
Jerome:When I hear Scott Glenn, I think just about anybody that's in sound, soul lambs.
Jerome:That's what I think of when I hear their names.
Jerome:I should
Chris:have, I should have went more obscure.
Chris:Cause those, those, he, he's a big name,
Jerome:but, but again, But again, as we've talked about, that's three
Jerome:degrees much to do about nothing.
Jerome:Remains of the day Sounds so lambs.
Jerome:It could probably be done in less True if you really dig deep because Scott Glenn's
Jerome:been in so many movies, you could, they're probably in a movie together for crying
Jerome:out loud that we don't even know about.
Jerome:You know what I mean?
Jerome:Or I'm not even thinking about if you take the time, I bet you could be done in less.
Jerome:You know what I mean?
Jerome:And again, the point of this game isn't to stump me.
Jerome:It's to see if there are two people that cannot be connected.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:And, and you, you picked two fairly easy ones, but that's cuz we rushed it.
Jerome:We rushed it in time for the show.
Jerome:Yeah.
Jerome:But yeah, man, Ethan Hawk finally getting some love.
Jerome:Yep.
Jerome:Ethan, if you ever hear this, we love you and we think you're the lead in
Jerome:every movie you're ever in, despite what producers put on the poster.
Chris:Well, that does it for this episode of The Silver Screen, happy Hour.
Chris:I wanna thank you for listening and I want to thank you for
Chris:listening all the way to the end.
Chris:if you did, that probably means you really are enjoying hearing
Chris:our banter back and forth.
Chris:we would really appreciate if you would share this with,
Chris:your movie Loving Friends.
Chris:Give us a, a review wherever you're listening and, we'd love to hear from you.
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Chris:So yeah, until next time, enjoy some movies and cheers.
